Good morning, Autopians! Today we’re exploring the cars of Great Britain, in the form of two US-market models outside of the normal MGB/Spitfire/Midget realm. But before we can do that, let’s see which all-American ride you chose:
Van-tastic! The orange Dodge takes it. I imagine the vote might have been closer if the Camaro had the proper number of cylinders, but that’s what we had to work with.
Now, before we begin with today’s choices, I feel the need to point something out:
That is the Lucas Sport ignition coil in my own MGB GT. I installed it because the car runs a lot better with it than it ever did with the Mallory coil and ballast resistor it used to have. It also still has its original Lucas points-type distributor, starter, alternator (though I do have a Delco alternator to install, strictly for more amperage), and most of the switchgear. I only mention it because I know we’ll get a bunch of “Prince Of Darkness” jokes, and us British car owners get a little tired of hearing them. My car runs and drives just fine, thank you, and according to the sellers, so do both of these. Let’s take a look.
1967 Morris Minor 1000 – $7,000
Engine/drivetrain: 1.1 liter overhead valve inline 4, four-speed manual, RWD
Location: Los Alamitos, CA
Odometer reading: 36,000 miles
Runs/drives? Sure does
Before there was the Mini, there was the Minor. Sir Alec Issigonis’s first mass-market people-mover entered production in 1948 and didn’t stop until 1971, surviving the corporate mergers that created British Motor Corporation, and then British Leyland. All told, they built 1.6 million of these things.
The Minor is a fairly conventional design compared to the later Mini, with its engine oriented longitudinally, driving the rear wheels via a four-speed gearbox and solid rear axle. Early Minors were powered by a Morris side-valve four-cylinder that dated back to before World War II, but the Minor gained a power upgrade in the BMC merger in the form of Austin’s A-series overhead valve engine, also used in the Mini and the Austin-Healey Sprite. Displacing 1,098 cubic centimeters in 1967, it put out a less-than-neck-snapping 48 horsepower. (Fun fact: the Austin/Morris A-series engine is so British that, in a pinch, it can briefly be run on tea and digestive biscuits. No, not really.)
Inside, minimalism is the name of the game, and as you can see, the central placement of the speedometer in the later Mini was nothing new. There’s nothing here you don’t need, but nothing you might call a luxury either: you get lights, wipers, and a heater fan, but no radio. This is a left-hand-drive US export model, so you don’t need to worry about learning how to drive on the “wrong” side of the car.
Though it is a rust-free California car, this Minor could use a paint job. It has primer on the rear quarter panel for an undisclosed reason, and the green paint is looking pretty faded. But honestly, I’d be tempted to just drive it as it is. Even with the ugly blotch of primer, it’s a lovely little car.
1962 Triumph TR4 – $6,500
Engine/drivetrain: 2.1 liter overhead valve inline 4, four-speed manual, RWD
Location: San Antonio, TX
Odometer reading: unknown
Runs/drives? Yep!
Fancy something a bit more sporting? How about an early example of Triumph’s first “modern” looking roadster, the TR4? This car stirs up some memories for me; my dad had a British racing green TR4A in similiar condition when I was four or five years old. One of the neighbor kids was afraid of it, and tried to convince me that it ate kids. But I knew better. It just ate my dad’s weekends, and my mom’s patience.
[Editor’s Note: Just want to shout out the dual SU carbs, because I like them, with their weird bottle-looking dashpot design. My old Volvo P1800S had a pair of these, too, and they used to leak fuel right onto the exhaust manifold below, where it would smoke alarmingly. Still, I really like SUs. – JT]
The TR4 was an evolution of the earlier TR2 and 3 designs under its flashy modern bodywork, with a bored-out version of the same four-cylinder engine found in earlier Triumphs. It also still used a separate frame and body, in contrast to rival MG’s new unibody MGB. But to be fair, in 1965 Triumph upgraded the TR4 with independent rear suspension, something the MG never got, though this early TR4 still has a live rear axle. The seller says it runs and drives well, and has a new radiator and brakes.
It does suffer a bit from that British roadster disease: rust. It’s confined to the front fenders and the driver’s side floorboard, and the seller is including a new floorboard. But once again, if it’s structurally sound, the cost of repairs to get it repainted probably aren’t worth it. Just embrace the patina, and enjoy driving a car with proper wire wheels and a tonneau cover.
If you did want to restore it, parts are certainly available. You can throw an entire Moss Motors catalog at it for the trim pieces and carpets, weld in the new floors and patch up the fenders, and give it a fresh coat of paint. In fact, you could do all that a little at a time, in the winters, and enjoy driving it in the summers while you fix it up.
Look, I know British cars have a reputation for being unreliable, leaky rust-buckets that suck your wallet and your soul dry. But they don’t have to be. Fixing one up can be very rewarding, and few cars will put as big a smile on your face doing something as simple as driving to the grocery store on a nice summer day. You may have to spend a little more than you once had to, but cheapish driver-quality cars are out there. And they’re well worth a look. Which one of these strikes your fancy?
(Image credits: Craigslist sellers)
I’ve owned 5 Morris Minor over the years. Currently a 1959 Tourer (Convertible) and a recently sold 1968 Traveller, the woodie wagon. They’re fun to drive, offer surprisingly good handling and are comfortable for full size adults.
This one is a 1098cc version which would have the 4.22 diff ratio giving it good take off from a light – as VW’s of the era did – but are buzzy at road speed with the comfortable top speed being +-60. Mine like 55.
The easy upgrade is the 1275 version of the A Series engine from a Midget or Sprite with that car’s 3.9 diff and the front disc brakes. Not to say people haven’t LS swapped them, but that’s crazy. They are totally supported, There’s really nothing you can’t get parts wise from England. You could even convert this one to a convertible with supported items.
It looks tidy save for the paint which is a decidedly non standard color. (I generally don’t care for modern metallic on cars of this style) A respray here in America would, though, run well over $5,000. If it was originally an import car it could be fairly rust free but Morris Minors rust on a professional level. It’s there, even if you can’t see it.
Needless to say – it gets my vote!
My first car was a Spitfire with that same faded red-to-orange paint. I had it less than two weeks before trying to perform a barrel-roll with it. Important safety tip: don’t attempt barrel-rolls in TRIUMPH Spitfires, only SUPERMARINE Spitfires. Due to this, I would prefer the solid rear axle of this older TR4 to the swing-arm IRS of the later ones.
Voted Minor as I have an abiding affection for them after looking after a ‘59 convertible for a few years. In fact, it’s a good thing this one is thousands of miles away from me as my Shitbox Upgrade account is pretty healthy currently. Also good that it doesn’t have the oxblood red interior: if it did-and were within a few hours of me-I’d have called already!
Think I’d best get back to work before I start searching CL.
I’m voting for the Minor because rust issues like on the TR4 have a way of getting over your head way faster than you ever imagined.
Sure no one knows what the Minor is but that’s its charm and you could drive it as is the rest of your life.
Like Mark, I’m not going to sit here and let anyone badmouth British electronics. The first car I bought was a 71 TR-6 full of bondo and, I slowly learned, parts from other models. Once I rebuilt its TR-4 carbs, cleaned all the grounds, and replaced a few crusty relays it was rock solid reliable.
I would have chosen the Minor because in this instance it’s the better car but you had to put it against a British roadster…and my heart just couldn’t vote against it. The TR4 might be more work, but it will always be more fine to drive. It will always be more passionate to work on. And hey (for the top gear fans) you don’t have to worry about pianos randomly falling from the sky!
I love British convertibles, but that Minor is charming and rust-free. I’ll take the Minor and go full teaboo on my runs to the pub.
I know this is the modern version of the “LS swap”, but I’d love to see an EV swap for the Morris Minor! No extra gauges to worry about, and everything else on it is in great shape!
I’d probably keep the faded green paint and feather-in a respray over the primer. No one expects perfection on these.
[Editor’s Editor Note:JT: That wasn’t smoke but rather vapor — gasoline vapor. And yes, you got the alarming part right.]
When Lucas electrics work, they are just fine. however Durability , is not their strong point. Never knew when they would go on strike.
The key I’ve found is ensuring good grounds and securing those darned barrel connectors.
Minor. let the sports car guys try their hand at the weird Patina TR. Honestly the minor once it finally give up the ghost engine wise, would be a very interesting D9 electric swap candidate as you only need 50-100 hp in that little thing. so the conversion kit would be much less.
I find the TR4 rust scary, they quickly died of salt around here.
The Morris Minor is a tank and looks like more fun and my head was quickly thinking of a bolt-in engine swap and suspension work. (-;
I had an abysmal ownership experience with an MGB 20+ years ago that was so bad I swore off of all things British. These days I can finally bring myself to watch Monty Python and wear Reebok shoes again but I’m still wary of British automobiles.
That said, this is all make-believe anyways so my vote went for the Morris. Sure the convertible roadster should be more fun but the Morris has always looked friendlier to me and it has less rust.
And the Minor say you like to party. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6470913/Morris-Minor-drivers-Britains-worst-drink-drug-driving-study-finds.html
Wow, I don’t know what a Panther is, sounds like the Panther Owners group was doing a pub crawl if 33% of it’s owners got a DUI in one year…..
Panther made a variety of almost-kit cars right up until the six wheeled Panther Westwind.
https://www.panthercarclub.com/
So it’s the Dodge Ram of Britain?
So I did get a MGB last spring. It was the cheapest running/driving MG in the area but about $3000. Hopes for it were not high. Surprisingly the only issue is the heater core leaking. I was able to replace it and put isolation valves if problems arise.
Knock on wood, it seems fairly reliable even though the wiring appears to be ‘custom’. I am hoping it was sold because the guy didn’t want to put good money after bad.
My MGB had NO wiring when I bought it. Seriously, the previous owner had 2 wires coming off the battery, one to the coil and another to the fuel pump and it would run until the battery died. We printed out the wiring diagram and recreated the entire wiring harness by hand and got it running. Never had a single electrical problem with it until a machine shop left the lights on and killed the battery then hooked it up to a charger over night without bothering to notice that those cars are hooked up backwards.
No, instead mine had the overheating and warping the head every 3000miles issue.
The Triumph makes sense to someone who is able to work on the car themselves. The asking price probably leaves $15-20k on the table to bring it up to a presentable condition and not be completely upside down value wise.
I love, love, LOVE the Triumph TR4, but I just found out today that I love the Morris Minor even more
You’re a poet & didn’t know it…love it…yeah, I voted Minor too (Prefer the unique body style)
I picked the Morris, something about it like a resto-mod would make it look killer.
That Morris Minor is so darn charming it looks like a toy! I just want to push it around the living room floor while making “vroom vroom” noises with my mouth!
I’m a minor-league kind of guy, have looked wistfully at more clapped-out Minors than I should have, and tried to get my father to buy a new Minor when they made a brief re-appearance at Brit car dealers back in the mid-1960s.
This one looks do-able, though I’d probably investigate some Sprite-style mods — twin SUs and other goodies to get more suds from the engine (a streetable warmed-up A-Series should make 70-75 bhp, which would feel like a lot in this instance), plus front discs — and would prefer one of the Traveler half-timbered wagons, even though prices of those are way, way up there.
Have no experience with TR4s at all. No reason not to go that route, except for rust and the plain fact that I really dig Minors (don’t take that the wrong way).
And, for the record, having owned four British cars from the ’50s and ’60s (not counting my father’s two Austin-Healeys), I never, ever, had any electrical issues. And I got really proficient at rebuilding/adjusting SUs. They are friendlier in those respects than anything Detroit ever made.
I was a sad, shy 13-year-old feeling invisible and under-loved by my parents when my observant, kind and Steve-McQueen-cool gym teacher saw me walking and gave me a lift the rest of the way to school in his TR4. I felt like a king after that five minute ride. So TR4s forever!
In high school, I had a friend with a Spitfire. Every time I rode in it, I felt like one of the cool kids, esp. when we’d pull up to the curb in front of the school, Uncle Buck style.
I’ll take the green one
The TR4 is probably overpriced, and the rust is a problem, but it’s the Triumph over the car Nan takes down to the shops.
I love that both cars have the battery and the engine block aligned along the center axis of the car for proper weight distribution.
I’m picturing the Morris engineers with a large balance scale: on one side are the heater blower motor and the ignition coil, and on the other side are the carb and the air cleaner.
The scale is balanced! Huzzah! Back-slapping ensues and they all knock off for a well-earned pint.
Yeah! Great comment
MGAs and Bs originally came with two 6-volt batteries wired in series, one on either side of the driveshaft, for that very reason.
I really appreciate minor, but the valuecraft battery, ugh, what else was done as cheaply as possible?
Convertible > Fixed roof. But, I hate rust so Minor it is.
Agree completely. I really want a TR4 or 5 because I love the styling, and the oily bits aren’t an issue as I did all that on my TR6, but I hate rust. Hate it with the passion of the burning Sun. Voted Minor today, with a frown on my face.
Morris Minor Saloons can be converted to convertibles
I voted TR4, but deep down, I really want the Minor, too.
Was there ever a Morris Major?
There was!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morris_Major
Great news! It’s the Morris Minor!
I have no real firsthand experience by which to judge these British cars against each other. That said, my gut tells me the Minor is a major deal.