Baltasar Gracián once wrote: “It is better to be cheated by the price than the merchandise.” I fully agree. While it’s nice to get a good deal on something, after the deal is done, it’s far more important that the thing you purchased is satisfactory. But how can you tell? Is it better to look for a car with a checkered reliability record from a trustworthy source, or a known reliable car from a shady dealership? That is our question for this Friday edition of Shitbox Showdown.
First, however, let’s finish up with yesterday’s Dodges:
Well. It looks like that Avenger is going to sit in the tow yard a while longer. Just make sure you check the paperwork carefully on that Canadian Neon before handing over any money, eh?
Now then: Today, we have a special treat. One of our cars today is being offered for sale by none other than our long-distance pen pal and fellow Autopian contributor S.W. Gossin, from his own private collection. S.W. legitimately loves fixing up and resurrecting old cars, so you know whatever he has had to do to this car was done right, even if the car itself has a somewhat spotty reputation for reliability. But what, I thought, is the antithesis of that? How about a known-reliable “runs forever” car being sold at a fly-by-night used car lot in a sketchy part of town? Let’s see how they compare.
2003 Jaguar X-Type – $3,750
Engine/drivetrain: 3.0 liter V6, 5 speed automatic, AWD
Location: Wilmington, NC
Odometer reading: 151,000 miles
Runs/drives? Yep!
Jaguar has had as many pronunciations as it has had owners: “Jag-you-were,” “Jag-war,” the insufferably annoying “Jag-wire,” and to a certain teddy-bear loving auto journalist, simply “Jaaaaaag.” From 1990 to 2008, the leaping cat was under the ownership of Ford. Despite backing from such an industry juggernaut, Jaguar didn’t turn a profit under Ford’s umbrella, and Ford sold the marque, along with Land Rover, to Indian automaker Tata Motors in 2008.
The X-Type was introduced under Ford’s ownership, and shares a platform with the Ford Mondeo sedan. This similarity with a “common” Ford irritated some Jaguar fans, who claimed the X-Type was “not a real Jaguar.” But I’ve always thought that was silly; was the XJ6 of the 1970s “not a real Jaguar” because it shared a transmission with a Chevy truck?
Despite the Ford parts, including a version of the Duratec V6, the inside of the X-Type is all Jag, with creamy leather seats and wood inserts on the dash. Luxury has come to mean technology, and in the early 2000s before touch-screens devoured everything, that meant buttons, and the X-Type has more of them than a marching band’s uniforms. This Jag looks pretty good inside, with some visible wear on the seats and steering wheel, but no obvious damage.
Mechanically, S.W. says this car runs like a proverbial scalded cat, and has a host of new parts including a new fuel pump and filter, which apparently was quite an ordeal to replace. The X-Type has had a spotty reliability record, but with only 151,000 miles and a thorough going-over, I get the feeling you could get quite a few trouble-free miles out of this black kitty.
2000 Lexus GS300 – $4,975
Engine/drivetrain: 3.0 liter inline 6, 4 speed automatic, RWD
Location: Portland, OR
Odometer reading: 293,000 miles
Runs/drives? Sounds like it
There is a stretch of Southeast 82nd Avenue here in Portland that is lined on both sides by used car dealerships. Once in a while, a lot empties, a sign comes down, and a few weeks later a new sign goes up in its place and the lot fills back up, with Explorers and Altimas and Tahoes and whatnot. I am embarrassed to say that I have purchased a car or two from these fly-by-night shysters. It didn’t go well.
Often, the cars sold at these lots look just fine, but have a bazillion miles or mechanical problems that are obvious the instant you drive them. These are the cast-offs from the used car divisions of new car dealerships, bought by these dealers at auction for peanuts and marked up to the moon. And yet, they sell. This Lexus GS300 sedan has nearly 300,000 miles on it, and while it looks all right, I’m certain the dealer has no history or records on it whatsoever, apart from whatever receipts may still be in the glovebox.
The GS is quite a nice car, a sleek rear-wheel-drive sedan with Toyota’s beloved 2JZ inline six under the hood. It’s backed in this car by a four-speed automatic; the GS wasn’t available with a manual. It doesn’t have the Olde Worlde charm of the Jaguar, but its interior still looks like a nice place to be. It’s nice and clean inside, especially for the mileage, but nothing lasts forever; a potential buyer would do well to make sure everything still works before purchase.
Outside, it looks quite nice as well, and it even seems to have escaped the “pink taillight syndrome” [Editor’s Note: This is a subject of active investigation, by the way, I hope to have a deep dive soon – JT] that plagues so many GSs, or the taillights have been replaced. White paint hides a lot of flaws, but from the looks of it, this car was cared for, and probably garaged. Five thousand is a big ask for a car with this many miles, but there is always some room for negotiation with these dealerships. You could probably knock as much as a grand off the price if you pay cash for it.
Buying a used car is always a gamble, of course, but it doesn’t have to be a shot in the dark. But which is ultimately more important: a reuptable seller, or a reputable car?
(Image credits: Craigslist sellers)
Normally Id vote Lexus all day every day. But they are out of their mind at $5000 for a car with those miles. Looks like it was well cared for, but most cars on buy here pay here lots are total turds that have been wrecked and slapped back together. Or have some snake oil in the transmission to diguise its slipping on your test drive, all kinds of shennanigans.
If the Lexus were from a private seller with proof that maintence had been done, Id buy it(not for 5 g’s though) Jaguar in this case just based on the seller, even though Ive always thought the X type was silly. If you are gonna get a Jag and deal with all the headaches, go get the real deal bigger XJ8
And y’all call yourselves car people. You’re seriously picking a white Lexus with a faded rental-car gray-going-green interior with 300,000 miles because… it’s reliable? Don’t you even like to spin a wrench?
In a weird coincidence, the only Jag I’ve owned (’87 XJ6 Vanden Plas) and the only Lexus I’ve owned (’11 LS 460, still have it) were both freebies. I don’t really care about the Lexus’ high mileage; that’s what they do. But knowing nothing about its maintenance history is indeed a problem when the mileage gets that high. And on top of everything else, it’s boring to look at from the outside, and from the inside it looks like a grimy 1991 Chevy Astro recently retired from the AT&T service fleet. It just looks like no fun at all. At least my 2011 Lexus is black and shiny and ridiculously well-appointed and meticulously serviced and feels (and looks!) like a genuine luxury car, not an airport rental. And like I said, my current Lexus was free, so I can’t stomach spending five grand on one that’s uglier, older, has well over twice the mileage, and no maintenance history.
By contrast, that Jag is spiffy. It’s nowhere near my favorite Jag, but it looks swell (the interior is almost shockingly similar to my old Series III) and Gossin’s endorsement means quite a lot. (If nothing else, if it Lemonizes on me, I know where to reach the guy!) I mean, the guy has a reputation to uphold, has put in the good-faith effort, and the price reflects a perfectly humane reality rather than a fly-by-night cash grab. That deserves to be rewarded. If this car weren’t three time zones away, I’d pay his asking price after no more than a 2-minute test drive and a brief peek underneath. And when it breaks, I’ll spin a wrench on it because I like to work on cars, especially ones that I’d enjoy driving. I would not enjoy being in that gray-on-white Lexus.
Very much appreciated, my good man!
Pulling that gas tank to replace the fuel pump required dropping the exhaust, driveshaft and rear diff – it wasn’t fun. Every bolt was torqued to spec and anti-seized for future-proofing.
In the end, the car was saved from Pick n’ Pull.
Thank you for the above kind words and measured insight. I like your style.
Not all car enthusiasts have mechanical ability! As a car enthusiast who sucks at fixing cars, I have to consider reliability. The Lexus seems a bit dodgy, but it is still a Lexus. The Jag is more interesting, but someone like me shouldn’t buy a used Jag. Reluctantly, I have to pick the Lexus.
This. Not everyone has the space to work on cars, nor the time. That doesn’t mean we don’t like to deep dive and learn about auto and the industry.
Jaguar once again.
Of course the Lexus is the better known quantity in general, but I’d much rather have a well-cared for Jaguar along with a few extra dollars to help keep it on the road. As I’m indifferent about that era of Lexus, but genuinely like most Jaguars (even the X-types), I’m going to be more likely to keep up on the maintenance and overall appearance with the Jaaaaag. I just don’t see myself out in the driveway enthusiastically detailing that Lexus.
I’m going to choose a Lexus with a proven drive train, and that looks to be in pretty good shape (amazed the driver’s seat isn’t torn to shreds) over just about anything, even at this mileage. Arguably it was also a much nicer car when new as well. I don’t remember too many rave reviews about the X-Type.
The Jag will likely shot a spark plug at some point, but otherwise it really is just a first gen Ford Escape with a Fancier body and less clearance. The AWD is a positive for me in this case. the Rebadged Crown is interesting and if it had just 200K on the clock I might think twice, but this one has high miles for even a Toyota product, and one that has limited parts in the US at that.
Big thanks to Mark for featuring my Jag today. Drinks on me next time, buddy!
He’s a solid dude that brings the fire to The Showdown everyday, in my book.
Hip-hip!
Probably would avoid both, but chose the Lexus, because even a really well polished and cared for turd is still a turd at the end of the day. There is at least a chance the Lexus would be a diamond in the rough.
Lexus.
I’d buy it in cash, and immediately take it to a Lexus service center to have them give it the once over. Because even if I end up spending more than I would like to get it sorted properly, a mechanically sorted, understressed 2JZ is ready for another 300k miles with little more than routine care. Thus, the long term cost to operate is much lower.
Well, Mark, I would normally go with the more reliable car. But in this case, since you’re personally guaranteeing the transaction (and I really appreciate your throwing in the 3 year/50K bumper to bumper warranty), I’ll go Jaaaaag!
S.W.’s ad, “-Full tank of premium gas”….. ???? Every $ matters.
Picking up 1 yd in a run on 2nd down still moves the ball that much closer to field goal range.
An extra $60 of gas goes a long way with the crowd that is trying to scratch together $3600 for a fair offer on a 20yr old car.
Plus, the car takes Premium. Including that nugget of info in the ad was to inform perspective buyers of the slight additional costs this car brings at the pump.
Cheers!
This is definitely a case where you buy the owner, not necessarily the car.
Also, good luck buying a car with cash at a buy here, pay here place. Many won’t even sell you a car unless you finance it through them. That’s their entire business model.
This is a tough one as I’m a ‘Jag’ guy and currently on my second (an F Type which has followed an XE). Even with that I really like the Lexus GS. I think on this one it does come down to a who would I rather deal with and the ad for the Jag is more appealing than the no credit no worries ad for the Lexus.
God this is a tough one. I feel like you always save the best for the end of the week Mark, and you’re really feeding off all of the Jaaaaaaaaaag love we’ve shown in the comments as of late. But alas…if it comes down to one of the least desirable Jaaaaaaaaaaags of all time (no offense towards our friend S.W. intended) vs. a 2JZ, I must go 2JZ.
That Lexus will run forever and surround you in a comparable amount of luxury…not to mention it’s wonderfully anonymous, whereas Jaaaaaaags too easily fall into the conspicuous consumption side of things. I prefer to be subtle and have nice things that most people don’t notice.
Also…I went to a pretty rich, white school for college (partially due to scholarships but I was also a fairly well off, and I am, in fact, white) and a lot of the more spoiled kids on campus were given X or S Types as their first cars. I just can’t shake that association. 5-10 year old Jaaaaaaaag meant frat douche or sorority girl. To this day it affects my perception of these cars.
None taken; fair play.
“Game on!” – W. Campbell & G. Algar
I appreciate the trouble the seller went to to make sure the Jag is sorted out. I am of the same mindset. I would rather just make sure whatever I am selling is in good order instead of having to make excuses for things. I sleep a little better at night that way, too. Anyway, even a well-sorted Jag is still a Jag, and it will UNDOUBTEDLY need some attention during my stewardship which comes with major headaches given the brand. The Lexus, on the other hand, looks very well cared for, and I would suspect the reason it ended up with a “buy here pay here” outfit is the mileage. Whatever it needs, I should be able to handle.
The only people saying Jag are those that have never owned one.
I voted Jag and I owned a 1993 XJ6. Great car, worst part about it was that it required premium gas.
Yes, the old XJ’s were decent cars with a little maintenance. The newer ford Jag’s are a nightmare maintenance wise compared to a lexus. Not to mention the lexus rides better, is better built, and will outlast the jag three times over. Just change the timing belt and water pump every 100k.
I hear you on that. To be honest, I don’t really trust the Ford Jags that much. But the author makes a good point of examples of the vehicle and “buying the seller.” I mentioned in another post, that I trust the guy selling the X-Type more than the dealer selling the GS300.
Definitely right on that one. Whenever I’m looking at a used car I try my best to try and purchase one from a private party over a dealer.
I’m going to choose the Jag, because Gossin. Truthfully, the X-Type is far from my favorite of Jaguar’s offerings, but it looks to be in fair shape and a fair price these days.
Lexuses (Lexi?) are well and good, but this one has a lot of miles on it and considering who’s got it up for sale, a PPI is not optional. Like you said, nothing lasts forever, even the 2JZ.
The first round of drinks is on me, shall our paths ever cross, my man.
Cheers to that. Thanks for the note and I look forward to your future articles!
I would like to own a 2jz one day, but want three pedals for it, so I voted for the wood-filled Mondeo. As it has recently been gone through, I have some confidence that I could put a fair few miles on it before it brings me crying to my knees.
Yes, please, to the deep dive on the “pink taillight syndrome” especially since that’s pretty ubiquitous around here on account of the typical longevity of those Lexuses. On another taillight topic, didn’t VW issue a recall in the late 90s or early 00s for some Karmann Ghia taillights where they actually gave any (lucky) owners of affected Karmann Ghias brand new taillights regardless of whether they were the original purchasers? That’d be something worthwhile delving into, it seems.
Wait, so VW gave people new taillights for a 20-30 year old car? I mean the OG Ghia ended production in 1974.
I have to think any catastrophic issues the Jag may have been vulnerable to would have reared their head by 160k, right? Going Jag.
Toyota > Ford any day
The GS300 has the legendary 2JZ yo!!!!!!!!!!!!! (sorry, I had to)
No really though, Toyota makes the best cars.
Yeah the Mondeo has a hood ornament, which is fucking awesome, but it’s still a Ford.
The X-Type is the best Jaguar ever made, but that’s only because other Jags are even shittier. The only way I’d choose the X-Type over a Toyota is if it was a wagon. Yes, they actually did sell the X-Type wagon in the US, and theoretically, you could even get a manual X-Type wagon with the hood ornament in the US.
I actually saw an X-type wagon on the road, once!
It blew my mind, and I ended up going slightly out of my way just to follow it a little more so I could ascertain it was in fact what I thought it was.
Didn’t even have to read. Lexus.
Lexus Lexus Lexus.
It’s a Lexus. It’s the absolute most unstressed 2JZ. It’s a simple Aisin automatic. If you can’t find parts to fix it, you didn’t look. If you can’t fix it, you shouldn’t be working on cars. Seriously. The car is so over-built that even long after the interior disintegrates it will just keep running.
Jaguar with a V6? Forget the elitism – it’s a Ford-era Jaguar. The build quality is… uh… yeah. It’s not a Ford Vulcan under the hood, it’s a Jaguar V8 with two of the cylinders filled in. The electrical will make you cry.
Preface: on the face of things, I agree with you and the other voters…to an extent.
BUT, all things being equal, the GS300 trumps the X-Type, that’s a no-brainer. I think the question being posed today is whether that particular X-Type is better or worse than that particular GS300. Otherwise it’d be an open and shut case, a total no-brainer.
I think when you’re buying a car, you’re buying the seller. I trust the seller of the X-Type to fairly represent the condition, and at that reasonable price, than some anonymous BHPH dealer selling a GS300 that has done Moon Miles and then some.
Well said! Cheers, mate.
Jag. I suddenly feel the need to become a middle-class white collar villain.
May not be considered real by some, but it’s got the Ford internals so you’re at least a little up there vis a vis real jags repair-wise, and it has actual style. And…Leaper on the hood! (Does Jaguar even offer that anymore on its current models?)
Too bad there was no X-Type R with the Ecoboost 😉
There could be…
I will take the Jag from a well known source. Of course my finance manager will say no, but I could call it a stray?
Worked for one car, not sure I would survive a second try.
I had a 2004 Mazda6s with essentially the same platform under that Jag. I did have the manual with my V6 but it was fun to drive and as the parts are half Ford and there is a HUGE group of folks out there refurbing old Jag parts I voted there. The GS is nice. Really nice if I’m being honest, but who want’s to say “I’m driving the GS” Clarkson has it right “I’m driving the Jaaaag” is what you wanna say.
I own a 2000 Camry with 2 less cylinders and the same amount of gears. It will drive until the rapture comes. When it does, I am sure this GS will still be running. I’m willing to bet it was garaged it’s entire life considering it’s a white 2000 Lexus, and it’s not all polka dotted at this point.
*two fewer cylinders…
2 J Z! 2 J Z! 2 J Z! 2 J ZEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!
I’ve heard of bad things with the AWD system on the Jag, nothing concrete, but I was always warned to stay away from them. Even if it wasn’t an X-Type, its up against a 2JZ. C’mon.