If you’ve been following along at home, you probably know that I’m generally pretty meh about my Subaru Forester ownership experience and have been passively shopping for something else. I’m an auto journalist so this is fairly easy for me, as I can just try out all the other cars I’m considering. Today’s car? The Toyota RAV4 Prime, aka, the plug-in one.
I’m quite set on a hybrid, as most of my commutes are short, city drives of the kind that benefit from a hybrid drivetrain. This is why I’d love a Ford Maverick and am still actively lobbying for one, though my lobbying hasn’t worked thus far. I’d consider an electric car if I had the ability to charge it at home or work (aka home), which I don’t. The Corolla Cross Hybrid worked out quite well for me and is a little smaller than my Forester.
The family was fine with the Corolla Cross Hybrid and liked the two-tone, but we use our car like most people use their garages and the trunk was slightly smaller. What’s the perfect blend of sometimes-EV, usually-hybrid, reliable, and roomy enough? Enter the RAV4 Prime.
Argument #1: The RAV4 Is The Closest Thing To Our Forester In Size
Things that are better when they’re bigger:
- Chicken fried steaks
- 9th inning rallies
- Renaissance portraits
Things that are generally not better when they’re bigger:
- Artichokes
- 9th inning rallies when it’s the other team
- Cars
It feels like everything is getting bigger all the time. This is less than ideal, especially because I want to have the least amount of car that I can get away with at any given moment. Conveniently, the RAV4 is almost exactly the same size as my old Forester. Seriously, check the numbers:
The Forester is 181 inches long, 71 inches wide, and 67 inches tall. The RAV4 Prime is 181 long, 73 inches wide, and 67 inches tall. So it’s a little wider, but barely.
I borrowed the car to take on a road trip around Texas so, while it wasn’t living a comparable life to my Subaru in New York, I’d at least get to experience a range of driving experiences common to my daily life (going through a drive-thru, going to HEB, putting a kid covered in sand into a car).
Inside it’s a lot newer and nicer than our old Subaru, and it easily fits a family of three (that isn’t going to get any bigger). The tacked-on-screen design is the default in this class, even if it isn’t my personal favorite. Oh well, it was nice to have Carplay.
Out back, there was plenty of space for this long weekend trip, and my daughter had plenty of room to stretch out in the backseat. If there’s one thing that constantly bothered us about the RAV4 Prime it’s the powered rear hatch, which would nervously stop short with any interference, wait for us to hit the open button, then go the opposite direction of what we intended. I prefer a non-powered hatch which, again, is getting rarer and rarer in this class of car.
The front butt-holders in the Subaru are cheap cloth seats that are nevertheless comfortable. The front seats in the RAV4 are a little stiff for my taste, though it’s possible I need to wear them in a bit with my posterior.
My little gripes about the car’s day-to-day usability aside, there would be no discernable loss of function by switching from a Forester to a RAV4 Hybrid.
HOW THIS ARGUMENT DID (9/10)
Argument #2: The RAV4 Is Way Quicker Than The Forester
What, exactly, is the upside of a BOXER engine in my Forester? It’s hard for me to articulate. One thing I don’t get out of my symmetrical all-wheel is anything approaching speed. Most estimates seem to peg the 0-60 mph out of the Forester with the 2.5-liter flat-four at around 9 seconds.
My Subaru is usually loaded with crap, so I’m lucky to get down to anything that feels like sub-10 seconds. I mention “feel” because the Subaru’s CVT always gives the impression of being about as interested in change as your average 90-year-old billionaire.
As previously explored in my Corolla Cross Hybrid review, the RAV4 Prime has a great combination of a motor-assisted hybrid engine/transmission combination driving the front wheels and an electric motor for the rear axle.
If you’re delicate on the throttle, you can get far on just battery power, though you can’t get there fast. If you want to merge onto the highway, however, the combined 302 horsepower and smack of torque can propel the heavy crossover to 60 mph in just 5.7 seconds. That’s fast for anything, let alone a crossover.
Is this speed a necessity? Not really, but the way the electric motor makes up for a CVT’s natural tendency towards low-speed/low-torque sluggishness is something I’d pay real money for these days.
Handling was competent and the ride was slightly softer than the Subaru’s, though neither the RAV4 Prime nor the Forester are going to win any awards for dynamic performance. I’m looking for competent and the RAV4 is competent.
HOW THIS ARGUMENT DID (8/10)
Argument #3: The RAV4 Is Way More Efficient Than Our Forester… Especially If You Can Plug It In
This trip centered around a voyage back to my original home, Corpus Christi, Texas. It’s a coastal city with miles of beaches and plenty of bars (people in the area have reported sobriety to be a challenge). What it lacked, surprisingly, was charging infrastructure.
When I picked up the RAV4 I quickly burned through the EV range it had and therefore the car was converted back into more of a traditional hybrid rather quickly. My dumb assumption was that I’d be able to recharge it at my hotel as I do with plug-in vehicles on most of my trips.
Nope. My hotel didn’t have a charger. The hotel next to it didn’t have a charger. A quick look at Google Maps shows the only chargers around were either Tesla Supercharging Stations or a part of a car dealership:
There were two non-dealership ChargePoints and one Blink station in the vicinity, though neither was near the hotel and both were marked as non-functioning. Oops.
When plugged in, the RAV4 Prime gets 42 miles of all-EV range, which is better than most PHEVs for sale. This is thanks to its larger-than-average 18.1 kWh battery pack. Because I can’t plug in at home, my sense is that I’d mostly be driving it around without that much juice (you can use a charging mode to generate power for the battery, but it makes the car less efficient).
In mostly city driving, the Forester returns a mediocre 20 MPG in my experience. The RAV4 Prime, however, gets 94 MPG combined city/highway if you can squeeze all the juice out of the batteries.
Even if I never plugged it in and relied purely on regenerative braking, the RAV4 returned 33.7 MPG in combined driving. That’s better than what I can get out of the Subaru.
The math here starts to get tricky fast. A nicely loaded Corolla Cross would cost me about $33k, assuming I could find a dealer to sell me one at MSRP. The RAV4 Hybrid Woodland Edition (hybrid, not plug-in hybrid) is $37k and returns a combined 37 MPG.
A basic RAV4 Prime costs about $44k, and if I can only rarely plug it in then I’m spending more money for basically comparable (or worse) performance than any other Toyota I’d be interested in if I can’t get charging at my parking spot.
HOW THIS ARGUMENT DID (4/10)
Conclusion: Maybe A Non Plug-In For Me
As a family, we were fans of the RAV4, in spite of some small annoyances. It’s so popular because it’s an extremely livable car in most ways. The RAV4 also looks modern and, compared to previous iterations, almost attractive (ok, the 1st gen is still the best).
It’s the gold standard for compact crossovers and, if I had a way to regularly charge it, the appeal of not needing gas for most of my journies might outweigh some of the cost.
I can’t get over the cost, though. In my situation, I think the RAV4 Woodland Edition is probably in the sweet spot for price, capability, comfort, and longevity.
I mentioned the Venza in a reply to another post…but…if you’re willing to get a Maverick, how about an Escape Hybrid? The FWD ones are widely available new under $30K (same drivetrain as Mav hybrid and cheaper) and the loaded AWD ones are in the $35K range.
Get one, and get an extended warranty.
I mentioned the Venza in a reply to another post…but…if you’re willing to get a Maverick, how about an Escape Hybrid? The FWD ones are widely available new under $30K (same drivetrain as Mav hybrid and cheaper) and the loaded AWD ones are in the $35K range.
Get one, and get an extended warranty.
I have a friend with a RAV4 Prime and I must admit the thing is awesome. I have generally been dismissive of any RAV4 made after Y2K, but the first time I rode in his RAV4 Prime I was seriously wondering if I should get one. He’s able to charge at home, so unless he is going on a trip, he tops up his fuel tank quarterly (he was still on the dealer-provided tank of gas with 1400+ miles on the odometer). Plus the packaging is good, I actually think it looks reasonably good, and it’s surprisingly quick (certainly enough for 99% of traffic situations).
I will agree that seats could be more comfortable, but I feel that way about most newer cars I sit in – why automakers have decided padding in seat bottoms needs to be rock hard is beyond me.
5.7 seconds 0-60 is fast enough for 150% of traffic situations. Remember how Jason doesn’t own a car that’ll do 0-60 in under 15 on a good day?
Hahaha! Fair point. I gave it 99% because of one interchange in Minneapolis/St. Paul that I had to drive on all the time where you had about 30′ to go from 5-55mph or get run over by traffic. Hopefully that interchange doesn’t exist anymore, but it was always a nerve wracking experience with my slow vehicles.
I have a friend with a RAV4 Prime and I must admit the thing is awesome. I have generally been dismissive of any RAV4 made after Y2K, but the first time I rode in his RAV4 Prime I was seriously wondering if I should get one. He’s able to charge at home, so unless he is going on a trip, he tops up his fuel tank quarterly (he was still on the dealer-provided tank of gas with 1400+ miles on the odometer). Plus the packaging is good, I actually think it looks reasonably good, and it’s surprisingly quick (certainly enough for 99% of traffic situations).
I will agree that seats could be more comfortable, but I feel that way about most newer cars I sit in – why automakers have decided padding in seat bottoms needs to be rock hard is beyond me.
5.7 seconds 0-60 is fast enough for 150% of traffic situations. Remember how Jason doesn’t own a car that’ll do 0-60 in under 15 on a good day?
Hahaha! Fair point. I gave it 99% because of one interchange in Minneapolis/St. Paul that I had to drive on all the time where you had about 30′ to go from 5-55mph or get run over by traffic. Hopefully that interchange doesn’t exist anymore, but it was always a nerve wracking experience with my slow vehicles.
If you can get away with a trunk instead of a cargo hold, a base Crown XLE is pretty nice and likely well under sticker – probably less than a comparable RAV4 Hybrid, or even a comparable Camry Hybrid with 2024 stocks depleted and 2025 production still ramping up. After all, you’re not getting any younger, so you may as well lean into it and get a full-sized sedan.
Ditto if he can track down a Venza. The RAV4s are hard to find for sale, and the Crown and Venza are invisible
I think I browsed around and didn’t see that many Venzas, or at least that many discounted Venzas. I was looking at high-option Limiteds, though.
One of the pros with the RAV4 is parts availability as a high-volume model. I’ve had issues getting parts for an Avalon but the same part for a same-vintage Camry was readily available, for example.
Plus the regular Crown looks….off (the Signia is neat-looking though). And the Venza screams “retirement village” or close to it.
If you can get away with a trunk instead of a cargo hold, a base Crown XLE is pretty nice and likely well under sticker – probably less than a comparable RAV4 Hybrid, or even a comparable Camry Hybrid with 2024 stocks depleted and 2025 production still ramping up. After all, you’re not getting any younger, so you may as well lean into it and get a full-sized sedan.
Ditto if he can track down a Venza. The RAV4s are hard to find for sale, and the Crown and Venza are invisible
I think I browsed around and didn’t see that many Venzas, or at least that many discounted Venzas. I was looking at high-option Limiteds, though.
One of the pros with the RAV4 is parts availability as a high-volume model. I’ve had issues getting parts for an Avalon but the same part for a same-vintage Camry was readily available, for example.
Plus the regular Crown looks….off (the Signia is neat-looking though). And the Venza screams “retirement village” or close to it.
Geez Matt, you’d think after all of these very compelling arguments your wife would’ve let you get out of the Forester already!
Geez Matt, you’d think after all of these very compelling arguments your wife would’ve let you get out of the Forester already!
FYI you can just manually push the lift gate closed, ignore the power b.s.
FYI you can just manually push the lift gate closed, ignore the power b.s.
Yeah, the non-plugin one makes way more sense if you have nowhere to charge.
I still can’t believe how good looking the current RAV-4 looks.
Good-looking? I guess so, compared to the current offerings from gm and Subaru, to name a few. It looks like it’s trying too hard to put on an angry face, and kinda resembles the “constipated wrangler” rather than looking like a shrunken 4Runner like they probably were trying for. Or like a pouting child, where they look more pitiful than angry.
It’s almost like looks are subjective, and not everybody likes the same thing.
Nah, that’s crazy talk. /s
-Me who went to university for a largely-unused art major.
Ha!
I got an Architecture degree before deciding to teach shop instead.
You must be a big fan of Star Wars. The Rav4 looks like what Darth Vader’s wife drives in the elementary school car pool.
Actually not at all. I last saw one of the original 3 movies when I was maybe 8, and haven’t watched any of the newer stuff.
Yeah, the non-plugin one makes way more sense if you have nowhere to charge.
I still can’t believe how good looking the current RAV-4 looks.
Good-looking? I guess so, compared to the current offerings from gm and Subaru, to name a few. It looks like it’s trying too hard to put on an angry face, and kinda resembles the “constipated wrangler” rather than looking like a shrunken 4Runner like they probably were trying for. Or like a pouting child, where they look more pitiful than angry.
It’s almost like looks are subjective, and not everybody likes the same thing.
Nah, that’s crazy talk. /s
-Me who went to university for a largely-unused art major.
Ha!
I got an Architecture degree before deciding to teach shop instead.
You must be a big fan of Star Wars. The Rav4 looks like what Darth Vader’s wife drives in the elementary school car pool.
Actually not at all. I last saw one of the original 3 movies when I was maybe 8, and haven’t watched any of the newer stuff.
Is the prius big enough? Good MPG and looks killer. These both seem boring.
The Prius isn’t quite big enough, in theory, though in practice it’s totally fine! I’m going to live vicariously through Bozi’s.
https://www.carscoops.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/Toyota-Prius-T-Demand-8ee-1024×576.jpg
Oh that’s too bad, a giant stepped on someone’s new one. Or that’s what it looks like.
Is the prius big enough? Good MPG and looks killer. These both seem boring.
The Prius isn’t quite big enough, in theory, though in practice it’s totally fine! I’m going to live vicariously through Bozi’s.
https://www.carscoops.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/Toyota-Prius-T-Demand-8ee-1024×576.jpg
Oh that’s too bad, a giant stepped on someone’s new one. Or that’s what it looks like.
On the whole, either one is probably a lot more reliable than other alternatives. Plug one is faster but the battery is heavy and expensive. So the basic hybrid it is! But then you spend your trips staring at the power flow animation, esp. the tiny slow charging battery, and thinking how splendid it would be have the full 18 KWh to play the ev-mode game with… because that is what one does. Financial side cannot really comment, but on this side of the pond the plug in would probably hold its value really well due to the long battery warranty and being Toyota, and not being bz4x. So the price difference could be offset by the resale value, when the phevs/evs become more popular and the charging network improves. It will happen.
In the meantime you can cash in by writing endless articles about the charging experiences in various locations etc. And troll Tracy with Leaf battery/range comparisons.
Loooool on two fronts:
What’s #3 of the two fronts?
Profit!
On the whole, either one is probably a lot more reliable than other alternatives. Plug one is faster but the battery is heavy and expensive. So the basic hybrid it is! But then you spend your trips staring at the power flow animation, esp. the tiny slow charging battery, and thinking how splendid it would be have the full 18 KWh to play the ev-mode game with… because that is what one does. Financial side cannot really comment, but on this side of the pond the plug in would probably hold its value really well due to the long battery warranty and being Toyota, and not being bz4x. So the price difference could be offset by the resale value, when the phevs/evs become more popular and the charging network improves. It will happen.
In the meantime you can cash in by writing endless articles about the charging experiences in various locations etc. And troll Tracy with Leaf battery/range comparisons.
Loooool on two fronts:
What’s #3 of the two fronts?
Profit!
Piano black started out on car interiors and is slowing spreading to the exterior surfaces. It’s like Venom from Spider-Man, slowly consuming the vehicles.
I hate the piano black trim on the Prime. Looks terrible. And then BMW decided to start putting it on their cars too.
Wait until it’s been in the desert sun for four or five years. Then it will be Charcoal trim.
Saw a new 5-series today. Thing thing is slathered in it. Rocker panel, half the rear bumper. Again, looks terrible.
Piano black started out on car interiors and is slowing spreading to the exterior surfaces. It’s like Venom from Spider-Man, slowly consuming the vehicles.
I hate the piano black trim on the Prime. Looks terrible. And then BMW decided to start putting it on their cars too.
Wait until it’s been in the desert sun for four or five years. Then it will be Charcoal trim.
Saw a new 5-series today. Thing thing is slathered in it. Rocker panel, half the rear bumper. Again, looks terrible.
Um, duh.
If you cannot plug in a plug-in hybrid, then you should not own a plug-in hybrid.
Move somewhere that you can plug in, and NOT at a freestanding place that will charge you more than the open market price of electricity. I don’t expect that this will be the last car you ever buy (no guarantees on that, as the world is son coming to and end, at least for humans and many other species), so get what you need for today. Toyota is always the answer when the answer is not Miata, should you want to keep the car for an extended amount of time.
Um, duh.
If you cannot plug in a plug-in hybrid, then you should not own a plug-in hybrid.
Move somewhere that you can plug in, and NOT at a freestanding place that will charge you more than the open market price of electricity. I don’t expect that this will be the last car you ever buy (no guarantees on that, as the world is son coming to and end, at least for humans and many other species), so get what you need for today. Toyota is always the answer when the answer is not Miata, should you want to keep the car for an extended amount of time.
Come on man! This is an automative site. It’s braking.
Lol, oops.
I wish my cars had regenerative breaking. I’d name them Wolverine and hoon them and never argue with door cards and single use trim bits or plastic pop screws again.
That would be AMAZING!
I mean, consider the content, right?
Come on man! This is an automative site. It’s braking.
Lol, oops.
I wish my cars had regenerative breaking. I’d name them Wolverine and hoon them and never argue with door cards and single use trim bits or plastic pop screws again.
That would be AMAZING!
I mean, consider the content, right?
My boss has a RAV4 prime. He go to just over 1,000 miles before he needed to fill up the tank for the first time.
My boss has a RAV4 prime. He go to just over 1,000 miles before he needed to fill up the tank for the first time.
Argument#4: it’s not a Maverick.
That probably won’t poll well.
But you know, it’s always easier to ask for forgiveness than permission.
Just drive off in the Forester one day and come home in the Mav. Tell ‘em it followed you home and didn’t have any tags on it and ‘please can we keep it,’
Tell them the old Subaru has gone to live on a farm out in Vermont or Oregon or Colorado with whole bunch of other Subarus.
If it didn’t involve shipping a Maverick from LA (I’d buy it from Galpin, of course)
-Beg off some “press trip” that happens to be in L.A.
-Sell Subaru before heading to airport.
-Drive Maverick home getting more than double what Mark did towing that MG across the continent.
-Write story
-?????
-Profit