We took Presidents’ Day off yesterday so we could spend the day on Midjourney trying to make the perfect AI-generated image of Teddy Roosevelt driving a Mark III Toyota Supra. Unfortunately, this request caused a glitch in the Matrix and proved once and for all that we are living in a simulation. Still, a life lived in a simulation is still a life, and for us, that means the car news must be delivered unto you, our beloved readers and (hopefully) subscribers.
Today, we’re talking about the latest round of Ford quality woes; the updated Cadillac XT4; and lowriders. It should be a good mix of stuff to ease you back into your work week.
Some F-150 Lightnings May Have Faulty Batteries
Ford, and its costly quality challenges, were both back in the news last week after a report emerged that an F-150 Lightning’s battery caught fire during an inspection. Now, Phoebe Wall Howard at the Detroit Free Press reports that another, unrelated issue may affect as many as 100 trucks already in customer hands, and it actually makes a decent case for connected car technology.
To be clear, again: this is not the fire issue. It’s a different thing, that could prevent the pickup truck from shifting into “drive ” or it could cause the truck to lose power during operation. From the Free Press:
“We monitor vehicle data to help ensure our vehicles are performing as expected in the field. We have identified that (in) some vehicles, their high-voltage battery is not performing as intended, which could result in performance degradation,” Martin Gunsberg told the Detroit Free Press.
The automaker is aware of an estimated 100 vehicles potentially affected but Ford cannot definitively say how many more may have a faulty battery because these issues are detected through vehicle data monitoring, Gunsberg said.
Customer vehicles are linked through cellular connectivity to Ford, as designed, and that signals data that detects emerging problems so they may be addressed without delay, Ford CEO Jim Farley has said.
“In this case, a driver may receive an alert in the vehicle through a message display system on the dashboard, and the vehicle will begin to reduce power to allow the customer to drive to a safe location,” Gunsberg said.
CNBC, which first reported this story, notes it’s not a recall yet but a “customer service action” where they’re still investigating things:
“This not a safety recall. This is a proactive investigation to help prevent customers of the identified vehicles from experiencing a degradation in battery performance and to obtain field parts for evaluation,” Ford spokesman Marty Gunsberg said in an emailed statement.
If you own a Lightning, I suppose keep an eye on this matter and bring the vehicle to your dealer if you experience the problem. The electric truck has been a groundbreaking product for Ford, but not without its quality issues so far.
Ford’s Quality Cleanup
Amid all of last week’s Ford news—which was not the sort of image the Dearborn automaker wants to project—I wrote about the company’s challenges with cleaning up its quality and reliability while also investing heavily in EV and battery tech for The Verge. The thing is, I do believe Ford’s working on this. Specifically, CEO Jim Farley is.
Farley has been incredibly candid about the cost issues involved with recalls and the challenges of pivoting to EVs while fixing manufacturing issues, more so than your average meat-sack CEO tends to. Maybe it’s his personality; maybe it’s because he knows that botched launches and quality problems have helped cost past Ford CEOs their jobs. Either way, everyone I have spoken to inside the automaker swears up and down that things are different now and that the culture’s shifted.
The proof will be in the cars themselves, of course, and it could take years before we see the results of whatever changes are being pushed now. But here’s Automotive News on how Farley is trying to execute this plan:
Cadillac XT4 Gets A Lyriq-al Upgrade
The Cadillac XT4 suits up for battle in one of the fastest-growing, most competitive segments in the U.S.: small luxury SUVs. It faces more headwinds there than, say, its big brother the Cadillac Escalade in the full-size SUV class, though. Since its introduction for 2019, the original XT4 is far from class-leading, but know this—that really pisses off leadership at Cadillac. Global Cadillac Vice President Rory Harvey is not happy with third place in the segment, and wants a higher spot on the podium.
But let’s be realistic here. While the Escalade is a storied nameplate that’s built a legacy of dominance over its more than two decades of service, the XT4 is much newer, with a harder-to-remember name. It’s also now dated, so General Motors is giving the crossover a refresh for the 2024 model year to try to boost its sales over the next decade as Cadillac transitions to an all-electric brand by 2030.
One thing it doesn’t get yet is Super Cruise, GM’s semi-autonomous driving assistance system that’s generally one of the better examples out there. That’s a shame, but it may have pushed the price tag beyond what was considered tenable.
Let ‘Em Cruise
Lowriders don’t get a ton of coverage in the enthusiast press, but they should; they’re an extremely unique and important part of American car culture. But did you know that several cities in California—the heart and soul of this country’s car culture—actually banned lowrider cruising decades ago? I did not.
Thankfully, that may soon be changing, reports the Wall Street Journal:
Beginning in the 1980s, San Jose and many other cities passed ordinances that banned cruising on favorite lowriding streets, after some were disrupted by shootings and other violence.
Now lowriding is becoming legalized again in California, amid protests by enthusiasts that they have been unfairly targeted on racial grounds. San Jose and Sacramento in 2022 repealed their bans. Earlier this month, a bill introduced in the state assembly would repeal remaining bans statewide, by stripping away a 1988 California law that allowed local governments to pass anticruising ordinances. Such ordinances can be applied to cruisers as well as lowered cars.
That bill was co-authored by Assemblyman David Alvarez, who represents the San Diego suburb of National City, where the city lifted a cruising ban last year—and then restored it after unexpectedly large crowds attended a sanctioned event.
“We feel this ordinance is targeting the Black and brown community,” said Jovita Arellano, president of United Lowrider Coalition, a San Diego group formed in 2020 to seek the repeal. The bans don’t target more upscale areas frequented by high-performance cars, she added. “The hot rods don’t get pulled over.”
That story’s worth a read in full, but here’s what happened when the bans were put in place in the 1980s:
San Jose banned cruising in 1986. Lowriders continued to ride, but not in big groups, and always with the fear they might get pulled over by police for an infraction, said Doug Vigil, 59 years old and a member of a lowrider club started in the 1970s called New Style.
“They would look for problems to give you a ticket,” Mr. Vigil said.
Kudos to the Journal for highlighting this story and the bias-related problems tied to the original bans. Let these dudes (and women) cruise. I figure these days, the cops have bigger problems with sideshows, street racing and street takeovers, and I have to assume the lowrider crowd is significantly more chill than those folks are.
Your Turn
Are you deterred by Ford’s quality woes in recent years? Would they put you off buying from the Blue Oval brand?
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I am one of those! Never owned a Ford and have always leaned heavily toward GM products. Over the years there have been a few Ford projects that I admired but never aspired. Maybe my loss, but at 76 I doubt that I’ll never know.
and for what it’s worth, I really hate the whole Mustang mystique.
Ah yes, the Mustang Mistique, also known as the Mustang III.
FWD, 2.0 Zetec with a 4 speed automatic, classic Mustang 3 bar taillights, and chrome Cobra badging on the trunk lid and front fenders.
Mercury wanted their own Mustang to sell, and Ford decided to show them to be careful what you ask for.
Mercury knew they had a stinker on their hands, and decided to play it safe by releasing it only in Canada as a ’96 model.
Some say that the utter contempt that Ford showed for Mercury here was the real downfall of the company, because like yourself, customers universally hated the Mustang Mystique.
I have not been deterred by Ford’s recent quality issues, I have been deterred by Ford’s persistent, ongoing quality issues over the past several decades
And the way they have built a business model around it, instead of fixing it.
Ford makes a lot of stuff that I want, but yes their quality control issues have me scared. Even my buddy who is a lifelong Ford guy, just bought a GMC.
Due to ford’s abysmal quality for the last 3 -4 years, I have told all my friends and family that if they wish to acquire a Ford product to ONLY LEASE one. Do not BUY one.
Regarding Ford and their quality… I once had an anti-Tesla shill once say to me that none of the legacy car companies ever have the quality issues that Tesla has had.
Riiiiiight…
“Lowriders don’t get a ton of coverage in the enthusiast press, but they should; ”
Counterpoint: No they shouldn’t. This crowd is responsible for ruining many nice old cars.
“Are you deterred by Ford’s quality woes in recent years?”
Their current quality woes are more or less how Ford has always been. It hasn’t stopped me from buying a used Ford in the past. But I am picky about *which* Ford to buy. I never buy the first year of a new design from Ford. And I’ll avoid certain options and features.
So I would buy a base-trim manual Focus. But if it has the PowerShit transmission and/or the Microsoft-based MyFordTouchedCrap/Sync/Sync2 sat-nav system, then it’s No Go car to me.
Counter Counter point, car hoarders have let many more desirable cars rot away than low riders have chopped up. I know a guy who has let 40-50 sixtys cars become unrestorable, including an e-type, because he will get to them someday. He’s also in his seventies and never finished a single car in his life. Would never sell anything to anybody.
Well we’ve heard from the pro-Tesla, doesn’t like brown people contingent now. Not surprised considering your hero’s apartheid upbringing.
Fords first model years are always advanced beta tests but let’s be real, everyone does it. Even down to video games having day-one patches, the societal pattern now is to get products out and fix any problems when they arise.
Fords issues started with the ’12 Focus/Fiesta transmissions, has just gone down hill from there. Ecoboost F150s are also troublesome. I would not even consider any Ford product save the V8 Mustangs.
“Ford’s recent issues”….Looks out the window at his 2000 Ranger with roof paint almost gone from flaking off because it got cold…yes recent.
I’m not sure how much they can reduce parts/complexity related to the recent recalls, which mostly seem powertrain/safety related. Like if it was just ‘too many climate control buttons’, they don’t recall for that. Brake valves, engine fires, transmission bolts, most cars need brakes, engines, transmissions.
It’s probably due to accelerated product development time, used to take over 8 years to develop a new car, now it’s almost half that, and people want it faster, and stockholders want to see dollars faster, so no time for proper designing/prototyping/testing to work out major issues.
“Are you deterred by Ford’s quality woes in recent years? Would they put you off buying from the Blue Oval brand?”
No, because it’s didn’t start happening recently in my eyes. ‘Lets get rid of the Truck 6, the actually compact Ranger, BOF vehicles, etc.’
Ecoboost engines are not long lived.
Fords automatic transmissions have gotten much worse since ecoboosts showed up with the Fiesta and the Focus ones being a great example of penny smart pound foolish.
Anyone who has dealt with old Aluminum bodied Land Rovers will tell you dissimilar metal corrosion is horrible. The Aluminum bodied F-150s are not long for the world, even if their drivetrains somehow magically survive the Rusting of the frames will happen so fast that it’ll make the old Taco frames’ rust problem seem nowhere near as bad.
I’ve seen 20+ Ford Explorer police cars at a Ford service center at once, and with all the recalls they’ve had over the years they were probably all in for recall work, which would negatively effect the policing ability of the department, no?
Fords most durable, reliable, and long lasting drivetrain in current production is the 2.5L Hybrid which is a port injection naturally aspirated engine that uses a Toyota designed e-CVT setup.
I don’t buy Fords because they have good ideas and arguably the worst follow-through of any automaker on the planet.
Ford: ‘Hey lets make a Compact Truck and market it to people in the city.’
Customer: ‘Is it going to turn tight?’
Ford: ‘Nope’
Customer: ‘Is it going to be compact at least?’
Ford: ‘Nope’
Customer: ‘Well it’s going to have more than one cab, bed, and seating configuration yeah?”
Ford: ‘Yes actually, you can have whatever cab, seating and bed configuration as you want so long as it’s a 4 door crew cab, 4.5ft short bed, with a 5 seat interior.’
Customer: -_- ‘So you grafted a short bed onto a unibody car platform, does it at least have a midgate?’
Ford: ‘Nope!’
Customer: Can I at least get it with a manual?
Ford: ‘Nope! Craptastic automatic with your craptastic ecoboost or a built Ford tough copy of a Toyota hybrid drivetrain as standard’
Customer: ‘Hybrid as standard? That sounds nice. Since it’s Standard you can make at least 50.1% of all Mavericks with the Standard hybrid drivetrain right’
Ford: ‘15%’
Customer: ‘15%?! Since when has 15% of production make a drivetrain the Standard Drivetrain?’
Ford: ‘Since we said so.’
Customer: ‘Can you do any better than that?’
Ford: ‘Fine! 35% BUT THAT’S AS HIGH AS I’ll GO YOU F***!’
Customer: ‘Fine, how long after I place my order can I get one?’
Ford: ‘Years.’
Customer: ‘YEARS? WHAT DO YOU MEAN YEARS?’
Ford: ‘Do you want it or not?’
Customer: ‘Yeah, but still this sucks.’
Ford: ‘Oh, and when it gets delivered be prepared for the Dealership to hold it for ransom or just sell it out from under you outright.’
Ford seems to have great ideas and then they screw up so badly that by the time they recover their competitors have already copied their idea and come out with a much better option in that same market. By the time all the current orders for the Hybrid have been fulfilled Toyota will probably already have out their version of the Maverick but it’ll come as a hybrid only (at first at least) with AWD-e probably utilizing the new drivetrain out of the new Prius, managing to get better MPG than the Maverick while being higher quality, more reliable, more durable, and with a much better dealer network.
Hell, Ram might end up beating out the Maverick. RAM OF ALL COMPANIES!
Yes, I think Ford painted themselves into a corner with the Maverick. They promised it and promised it, and at some point they felt compelled to deliver. And then came the supply chain issues.
If I understand correctly, every Maverick that Ford builds means one fewer Bronco Sport they can build, as they share the same plant and lots of parts. By my reckoning, the Bronco Sport is a more profitable vehicle, so every Maverick they sell hurts the bottom line.
Well firstly the Maverick should have been built like the ultimate city Trucks which are Kei Trucks. Cab forward/COE layout, Small (but they don’t have to be Kei sized small), lightweight, BOF, RWD as standard with a great turning circle with 4WD optional, low displacement tiny engine, etc.
Ford Already has the Fox 3 Cylinder engines which are perfect for that application. However Ford wanted to be first to Market and while they ended up making a vehicle a ton of people want to buy they can’t and or won’t make enough of them to meet demand, even though the whole idea of using an existing platform is to save time, money, and simplify production.
Arguably Ford would be better off canceling all Bronco Sport Production and just making Mavericks instead. Hardly anyone wants a Bronco Sport but you have people waiting for over a year to get their Maverick.
I think that the Maverick Hybrid might actually be cheaper than the Bronco Sport to make because the extra cost of the 1.1 kWh battery pack is offset by the savings from the planetary e-CVT, savings from the lack of an extra starter motor, no turbocharger, no expensive direct injection, etc.
I genuinely think that almost noone who would be happy with a Bronco Sport would be unhappy with a Maverick pickup.
I’ve lived near downtown SJ for the last 10 years and both the lowrider and donk crowd are the chillest around. I dunno if there were any problems with them way back when but considering *stares at the whole history of America* I’m going to bet on the bans being mostly racist.
I’ve had 3 Fords in the last 8 years, all ordered new. None had any major quality issues, but there are smaller ones that speak to a general lack of good assembly or product design. Rattles, broken/misaligned trim, hesitant shifts, surges from the over boosted engine, those sorts of things.
It hasn’t put me off (just ordered another one a few days ago) but I do wish they’d get their shit together. I feel like it’s just a matter of time before I run into a more substantial problem.
I realize what I’m about to say is an anecdote, which barely data. When Mrs. OverlandingSprinter and I shopped for a cargo van to turn into a B-class RV, we looked at Transits at the local dealership. On one vehicle, the “Transit” logo on the back door was mounted on a slant. Mrs. OverlandingSprinter said, “Let’s go. If Ford can’t get the logo on straight what else have they screwed-up that we can’t see.” I insisted we give the Transit a fair shot, but there was no getting over the slapdash assembly in her mind.
Then, that’s when the Sprinter came into the picture, am I right? How are y’all enjoying it!
“Farley has been incredibly candid about the cost issues involved with recalls and the challenges of pivoting to EVs while fixing manufacturing issues, more so than your average meat-sack CEO tends to.”
Jim Farley is also among those who approved the legendary PowerShit transmission despite Ford having a mountain of evidence and multiple teams of engineers saying it wasn’t fit for purpose and never could be.
Since 2020 he has overseen Ford’s internal efforts to do literally anything at all but recall the cars, fix the problem, and fight every customer in court to the death. Especially the ones that forced them to show they knew it wasn’t fit for purpose.
Repeatedly. To this day. There’s still PowerShit lawsuits going. Many of them. Including a fresh one in September for Ford refusing to honor the PowerShit warranties they agreed to as part of one of the settlements.
So excuse me if I take Jim Farley claiming he’s going to do something about quality as the very obvious bullshit it is. A commitment to quality starts with accepting responsibility, and Farley has spent 3 years and tens of millions of dollars to do the exact opposite.
The bans don’t target more upscale areas frequented by high-performance cars, she added. “The hot rods don’t get pulled over.””
“They would look for problems to give you a ticket,” Mr. Vigil said.
Exactly. These bans were nothing more than racist and discriminatory from day one. That was their sole purpose. Keep the ‘undesirables’ away from their white picket fences. To keep the ‘lessers’ ‘in their place.’ While allowing the white techbros to routinely do double the speed limit or more down cut-throughs, and drive dangerously without fear of consequence so long as it’s in a ‘nice car.’
Oh, and by the way? San Jose’s traffic deaths for 2021 were at an all time high, largely due to speeding. A single intersection has more than 6 hit-and-runs where pedestrians were killed. San Jose’s arrests and prosecutions for vehicular manslaughter and the like? All time low.
Are you deterred by Ford’s quality woes in recent years? Would they put you off buying from the Blue Oval brand?
They haven’t improved one whit from 2017, or from 2018. They’ve just gotten worse. Jim Farley is directing the company spend millions upon millions of dollars to try and evade responsibility for shipping known defective products. An actual commitment to quality includes fixing the things you know you got wrong and honoring the promises you made, even if it wasn’t on your watch. Period.
Doesn’t matter if Henry Ford VIII Jr. personally demanded they ship self-igniting cars and did it at gunpoint before jumping off the roof. The company shipped it. The company is responsible.
Jim Farley’s ethics are such that his complete lack thereof are on full show. He spouts buzzwords out one side of his mouth, and orders legal to spend what it takes to skip out on warranty and legal settlements out the other.
You couldn’t pay me to take a Ford.
Oh, and for people who think Jim Farley is even remotely qualified or competent as a CEO because “look! F150 Lightning!”
Yeah, no. He’s an unqualified idiot who failed upward.
Under his watch as the CEO and Chairman of Ford Europe, he launched the built in India Ka+ – which sold so poorly it was axed 3 years in, is notorious for it’s unreliability thanks to the same defective PowerShit transmission, and was oft described as ‘you get what you pay for and it’s cheap.’ His watch saw Ford Europe’s profits plunge so steeply that in 2019 the business lost $199M in a quarter. After losing over $398M in the year before. And essentially had everyone going “so when’s Ford going to exit the EU, since they’re just moving further from what cars people want here.”
‘Oh, and by the way? San Jose’s traffic deaths for 2021 were at an all time high, largely due to speeding. A single intersection has more than 6 hit-and-runs where pedestrians were killed. San Jose’s arrests and prosecutions for vehicular manslaughter and the like? All time low.’
Tied for the top spot with 2015.
https://sanjosespotlight.com/san-jose-makes-slow-progress-on-most-dangerous-streets-roads-intersections-corridors-traffic-deaths-fatalities/
Do you have any data showing the lack of arrests and prosecutions? If its true I’m not finding it.
” less content that assembly workers have to install”
So that means more work for the robots. Better hope they don’t decide to unionize.
Robots are all unionized under Skynet.
I believe we need more lowrider coverage everywhere, and not just that… Kustoms, hotrods, modified classics, minitrucks, fullsize trucks, air bagged imports and Euro’s.
I hang out in this site hoping to see something and rarely ever hear a mention…it’s all new tech and shit like that. Why not hear something from the guy doing Kandy paint in his garage, or the guys doing chop tops under a tarp in their front yard? Or the countless large shows all over the country full of these customized rides?
Not all of your faithful readers give a rip over new EVs and how big their infotainment screen is or how many miles they don’t go on a full charge…. Or even what track is going this and racer doing that and recal from a manufacturer.
Events such as SEMA wouldn’t be a thing if it wasn’t for car customization. Among other events, show some love to those that actually wrench on these cars..
https://www.theautopian.com/low-rider-car-culture-is-totally-underrated-and-the-incredible-automotive-cathedrals-at-the-la-auto-show-prove-it/
You speak the truth! The coverage has been ridiculously new cars and EV lately. Kinda starting to feel like the old site….
I’ve bought 3 Fords new and still own one.
2012 GT500 – Came with a faulty fuel pump design. “Ran out of gas” with 5 gallons still in the tank. Repaired under warranty. Otherwise no issues in 3+ years owning it.
2017 Fiesta – Poor cooling system design. Some components replaced under warranty. I did preventative replacement of others anticipating a long ownership. Ended up selling instead when I ditched my long commute. Some issues with the old Sync 1.0 system, also repaired under warranty. 80,000 mostly trouble free miles, but some concerning issues.
2019 F350. A couple of recalls so far for issues I haven’t noticed personally in mine. The worst situations I’ve seen are a bit of death wobble and a prematurely dead battery. 4.5 years of trouble-free ownership.
I guess my takeaway from all this is that I don’t think of Ford as much better or worse in short/medium-term quality than any other mass market brand that I’ve owned. I’d buy one again, but wouldn’t go out of my way to do so if the competition had some other compelling attribute.
the Death Wobble is the price to pay for a live axle front end. Many say they want a real solid axle up front, but anyone who uses their truck on the freeways do not in the end. it will likely just get worse, but it is a sign of a worn front end system, usually the track bar connections.
Ford’s AGM Batteries are also problematic, even from the factory. The AGM is superior in a vehicle used daily as they tend to last longer, but if left in an truck not used for 2 or more weeks at a time the various systems to diagnose and retain driver info for things like engine management and transmission shift points drain the battery. once an AGM battery starts getting too far drained or drained too often, they sulfate and ultimately fail.
Agree, I would have specced an IFS given the choice. The non-rusting aluminum body was so important that I overlooked many quirks of the Ford that I’d rather not have dealt with.
Dissimilar metal corrosion is a thing. I’ve seen aluminum Land Rover bodies and beds corrode through like how rust eats through steel.
Having a frame and a body that actively accelerate each others corrosion is not rust proof by any stretch of the imagination.
Now if it had an all aluminum chassis that would be a different story.
The aluminum body and steel frame are isolated from each other by plastic or rubber spacers to prevent this exact issue.
If you’re foolish enough to drill into the body and mount some kind of aftermarket accessory with steel bolts, then sure you’re asking for trouble. Same goes for if you get body repair work done somewhere that doesn’t know how to work on an aluminum truck. But as-built from Ford, galvanic corrosion is a minimal or non-existent concern.
They’re isolated from each other, until they are not. I’m sure David Tracy can attest to the fact that rubber bushings are everlasting and never get old and crumble away ever…. /s
The newest vehicle he owns is what, 30 years old? I love my truck, but I definitely do not expect to still own it in 2050. If I do by some weird circumstance, I’ll have enough time and money in my retirement to replace all the bushings.
The last 3 trucks I’ve owned before this one have been rust buckets at 10-15 years old; that’s the fate I’m hoping to avoid here.
Honestly I want whatever automobile I buy to last a lifetime. So long as I can get parts to replace the worn out ones said parts don’t have to last a lifetime but I’d want the automobile to last at least as long as I do which will be hopefully more than 30 years from now.
Just keep an eye on those bushings, once they wear out that dissimilar metal corrosion gets going quick!
I mean, Fix Or Repair Daily isn’t a recently created acronym so… ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Ford’s quality issues concern me. I wouldn’t put any Ford as my first option, if I was starting to look for a new vehicle right now. That ship has sort of sailed, though.
I’ve been waiting for my Bronco since putting in a day 1 reservation in July 7/20. Ordered a manual because, well, duh. I finally got scheduled for production next month. Now, it turns out that apparently 100% of the 7MTs are affected by an increasing grinding/scraping noise. It starts quiet in cold weather, increasing to a constant sound at all temps, and, eventually, grinding into 1st/2nd.
They have put out a TSB that has been confirmed to do nothing. Some owners have had 2 replacement transmissions that eventually have the same issue. I’m really hoping that they figure out a fix in the next month (it’s been a known issue for at least a year), and not an unavoidable design issue with the transmission that results in a buyback/class-action; a la Focus DCT.
My wife drives a DCT Focus on its 3rd or 4th transmission. Ford can’t seem to build a transmission to save their lives. I think they just need to buy off-the-shelf Tremec or ZF units.
In this case, the 7MT is off the shelf from Getrag.
I was so close to buying a Maverick when they first released. I had an order ready to go, and the dealer just needed me to sign it. I couldn’t do it for two reasons:
I like my PHEV, and would like to continue to commute on electric.
Ford quality has been hit-or-miss.
To be clear, if they announce a PHEV Maverick, I can deal with some recalls. The quality issues give me pause, but aren’t enough to put me off Ford entirely. But if, say, the Santa Cruz and the Maverick both drop PHEVs, I probably look at quality control issues pretty hard.
I got a maverick in shop right now for some kustom paint treatments… It’s been a perfect truck for the owner so far, with 15k and it being a hybrid as well….I like them
you would have likely not gotten it, but maybe you should have still tried. the ones we have around that are Hybrid start and drive on electric alone for the most part, until the battery gets too low of course. and if you still did not like that, you could have definitely sold it for much higher than you bought it for. Though 1st year anything’s are always somewhat sketchy and the maverick had a couple big recalls already,
I did sort of kick myself for not going through with it, but I don’t want to be the guy flipping new vehicles for a profit. I avoid using any gas at all on my commute, so having my PHEV is nice. I only need gas when I travel.
As for whether I would have gotten it, I kept on the forums, and others who ordered similar configurations at the time got theirs, though not necessarily in the first batch. So I do think I would have gotten it.
Honestly Ram will probably beat Ford to the punch by putting the PHEV drivetrain they’re putting into the new “Dodge” “Hornet” into the Ram 1200.
Ford was testing a PHEV Maverick a long while ago, so long ago they should have gotten it into production already.
With all the problems modern ICE cars have been having as they get older I’d rather just avoid all that and get a BEV.
Definitely watching to see if Stellantis does something like that. And I’ve been considering a full BEV, but I don’t own my home, so PHEV charging from 110 is a pretty good setup for me right now. I have also considered getting an EV pickup for my generally local pickup stuff and keeping a relatively efficient car for travelling, but I currently have too small a garage for a full-size pickup.
Very first world problems.
Honestly a BEV with a range extender is a much better option than a PHEV, sadly hardly anyone makes them. You have all the reliability, simplicity, and durability of a BEV drivetrain with the range of an ICE vehicle, all for a miniscule weight penalty via the tiny range extender generator unit.
Honestly the issue isn’t that your garage is too small, rather new Trucks and Pickups are too large. The Maverick which is called “compact” is 6.6 inches longer and 5.9 inches wider than my 94 Toyota pickup which unlike the Maverick seats 5 AND HAS A 75″ LONG BED.
I’ve never driven my Toyota and felt like it was “Compact” rather that it wasn’t oversized. I’ve never wished it was larger, or heavier. Honestly I don’t want any vehicle larger than my Toyota.
Yeah, a pickup that size would be fantastic. And a BEV with range extender would be great, but not really an option. Maybe the Ram will have one, but we get back to the size issue.
I’m okay with my little PHEV and my current pickup (2002 Silverado) sitting out front, but I would love a smaller pickup that could meet all my needs (and some wants–I don’t really need to be electric, but it is very nice to fuel via the garage). Then I could get back down to one vehicle and not be one of the people with a massive vehicle parked on the street.
I get the impression that Ford’s leadership team wouldn’t understand the concept of quality even if a copy of Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance hit them in the face.
I once worked as a production support engineer for a manufacturer of non-road vehicles. There’s a reason people in my position were given authority to change designs: endemic quality issues are an engineering design and testing problem, not a manufacturing problem.
So Jim Farley is going to go back to Ford and continue screaming at everyone to do quality better. But Ford sure as shit isn’t going to give their engineers the 20% more time and budget it takes to produce and test the kind of engineering design that inherently leads to good quality production, because God forbid engineering overhead cuts into Q3 profits. So we’ll be back here talking about Ford quality again in a year.
Agreed. Back in the late ’90s (or was it the early 00s? been too long ago), GM circulated a memo talking about reducing “unanticipated expenses,” which included vehicle recalls. (this was the “just good enough” era for GM). While GM is still recalling vehicles, it has not been to the extent Ford has. With the exception of the Delta One ignition switch (Cobalt, HHR, Ion, etc. – one can’t anticipate a supplier mistake like LG’s batteries on the Bolt), the memo had put most of the company engineers on the alert that GM was not going to tolerate failures in engineering that would cost it in the future. I remember one manager boasting about a competitor’s recall, and got rebuked for saying “now it’s them, GM’s turn in the hot seat is coming.” Sure enough, it did. (“Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance” was a required read in one of my college courses.)
I mean I bought a Hyundai in 2022 so clearly I’m willing to roll the dice on a recall or two happening. I personally don’t think the mess over at Ford would be enough to deter me if I was looking for a product that they have a competitive offering in the segment of. While their issues have been particularly bad the supply chain shenanigans have been unkind to everyone, especially companies making EVs. Hell, even Toyota had a nasty recall on their first EV.
Shit happens…however I’d like Farley to stop overpromising and under delivering. That irks me more than first gen products having hiccups. Ford has introduced a few excellent products, opened order books for them, then failed to get people their vehicles repeatedly. That’s incredibly lame and it’s created a scarcity in their products that’s driving up prices. Boo. BOO!
I honestly don’t even know an XT4 is. I can’t even picture one mentally. Hell I’m not even sure if I can consistently identify which small luxury crossover is which at this stage. It’s a market that’s wildly oversaturated with mediocre, indistinguishable products. They’re all the same size, they’re all the same shape, they all come in the same colors, they all make nearly identical power, etc.
IMHO it might be the blandest class in the entire automotive industry and all they are is gussied up versions of economy car platforms for rich dudes to buy their family members or image obsessed middle class people to either lease at the top of their budget or buy used so they can conspicuously consume. Im currently helping my mom find a replacement for her Audi Allroad that’s reached the “everything electronic has gone haywire” phase of its German car existence and she wants a luxury crossover.
I’ve never been so bored shopping for cars in my entire life. At this point I’m putting all of my effort into at least keeping her out of a sparkly white over beige one. She’ll never be able to find the damn thing in a suburban parking lot and I don’t want to deal with the inevitable “How do I tell which Q5 is mine” phone calls…
Sorry: rich dudes AND dudettes. Didn’t mean to gender that statement. I have a tendency to just throw dude out there willy nilly.
“I’m a dude. He’s a dude. She’s a dude. ‘Cause we’re all dudes.”
-Ed
Ha, yuuuuup. I’m trying to move away from the gender-neutral use of “dude” as folks don’t always read it that way, but as a ’90s kid who grew up with “Good Burger,” welp. It’s an uphill battle.
I’m working on not responding to everything with HELL YEAH BROTHERRRRRR but it just feels so right
I agree with your statements about those compact SUVs and I’d never own one. But somehow the Lincoln Corsair always catches my eye. It is kind of old fashioned in that it doesn’t try to be hip nor sporty and I like it. Can’t help you with the colors.
My mom wants a 1987 Benz 560SL once her manual Honda Fit gives up the ghost; I like to think that this will intersect with her 75th birthday. Sadly, the prices are shooting up much faster than our savings.
I actually think that small, spicy SUVs are a good compromise for enthusiasts with partners and/or families, and I’d consider something like an X3 M40i personally…but it would have to be on a dedicated, rear wheel drive luxury platform. The idea of paying 40-50k for something that’s just a dressed up economy car is nuts to me…particularly things like the XT4 (what is it, an Equinox? Y u c k), the X1/X2 (they’re minis!), or any of the Audi stuff that’s on MQB.
Save yourself several grand and just get the nicest version of the cars they’re based on. If you ignore the badge you’re getting the same experience. It’s especially weird to me when people who make maybe 50-70k lease these things as a stretch purchase. It just seems like a really silly way to spend your money but then again I suppose it’s none of my business…although I won’t lie, when I see young folks in lease special luxury compact crossovers “poser” is the word that comes to mind haha.
I rode in an XT4 once… My boss owned one and several of us from the office joined up and headed out to lunch in it. It was… underwhelming. Generic small-car 4-cylinder power and noise. Generically average, inoffensive typical crossover interior with some chrome bits and Cadillac badges glued on. Outside, it a had all the Cadillac styling cues pasted-on over a generic crossover shape. None of the performance, or real cachet of a Cadillac underneath the skin, though.
I’m sure it’s got all the practicality and overall comfort of a crossover, but nothing about it would make me feel like paying Cadillac prices for it. Bland is the operative word; it seems like Cadillac offered it to have a car in that class, but it definitely wasn’t really the focus of any significant efforts. So this refresh seems more like a fresh coat of paint and not much more. Using Lyriq dash/interior components amounts to basically a nice way to do a parts-bin upgrade on an otherwise unremarkable model.
“Either way, everyone I have spoken to inside the automaker swears up and down that things are different now and that the culture’s shifted.”
I don’t doubt his sincerity, he really does seem candid like you said. This seems to happen on a near-cyclical basis, quality slips, promises to improve are made, a brief Renaissance occurs, then complacency returns, quality dips, and the cycle begins anew. It’s maddening to watch unfold, because you know how the story ends, but maybe it’s all just human nature.
“In the future, the company intends to redesign its manufacturing process so vehicles have less content that assembly workers have to install, Farley said. He hopes to reduce the number of fasteners in a vehicle by half, he said, and move to larger castings with fewer parts, similar to Tesla.”
Here’s how I read this: more unified assemblies, more integrated systems, and more condensed options packages. Net result between the lines? More disposable (read: modular, non-epairable) parts in which one system failure affects others, even fewer choices for separate vehicle options, therefore higher base vehicle purchase prices and repair costs. But hey, at least it lowers Ford’s assembly process and bottom line.
Totally right about the cyclicality of all this. Remember “Quality is Job 1?”
But Ford has always existed lurching from one crisis to the next. At this point it’s pretty clear that way of operating, as maddening as it is, is just a part of the company DNA.
What also happened when cruising bans were past? Less car group shootings. Farley we need to make larger assemblies so our workers install less? The employees are screwing up the cars.
I took Farley’s comment as “employees are expensive, we need less of them”.
“Are you deterred by Ford’s quality woes in recent years? Would they put you off buying from the Blue Oval brand?”
Recent? Shiiiiiiit that’s been 103 years of recent
Yeah, “Fix Or Repair Daily” didn’t come out of nowhere.
It ain’t a Parsh, but I’d still trust Ferd’s build quality over Tesla’s, though.
…also, more like FLUSH Or Repair Daily, amirite?????
(because it’s not my turn, it’s the flush)
Batteries
>The automaker is aware of an estimated 100 vehicles potentially affected
That’s like 50% of their total sales *laugh track*
XT4 Upgrade
XT4, more like XT4gotten. *bigger laughtrack*
The not-flush
>Are you deterred by Ford’s quality woes in recent years?
How do you define recent? *biggest laugh track plus some clapping*
Thanks I’ll be here all week.
Jim Farley used to work for Toyota. He should know better about quality.