Cars are still a necessity for many Americans and, therefore, the culture of cars is likely to survive for a while. The long-term health of our culture is at risk for various external reasons and one big one: People acting like jerks.
Cars are awesome. I love cars. I devote most of my day to writing about, driving, or thinking about cars. Some of my best memories are in cars. When people online or in person explain their dissatisfaction with cars I am quick to defend vehicles not only as a form of transportation but also as a focal point for community building amongst often diverse groups.
Car culture is good for democracy. It is good for society. I interface with people I might otherwise not because of cars and, in doing so, have the kind of interactions that are necessary for a functioning polity.
Unfortunately, there’s a group of folks, best represented by the r/fuckcars subreddit, that see cars only as a societal evil. To them, cars are a historical mistake caused by greedy 20th-century capitalism that led to us remaking our cities for cars and, by doing, so clogged our air with noxious fumes and sent everyone out to the suburbs.
It would be easier to laugh off the group if there weren’t constant reminders that our hobby is at risk of being outlawed in different ways. And being a jackass really hurts all of us.
https://www.instagram.com/p/C3mL-qZuha1/?img_index=1
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C08zN2WuesS/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA%3D%3D
This has come up recently because of this gentleman, Miles Hudson, aka SRT.Miles, aka aka the “Belltown Hellcat.” He has a Hellcat Dodge Charger with a modified exhaust and his joy seems to be in driving as loudly as possible late at night in Seattle.
In watching a lot of these videos it’s not clear if Hudson’s goal is to represent car culture or just be an annoying influencer, but to the average resident nearby it’s a “car thing” and nothing else.
You can really get the sense of how this is about cars from a recent write up in Fox 13 Seattle:
Hudson’s Hellcat — a Dodge Charger modified with racing-grade software and an ensemble of aftermarket parts — wears a price tag close to $100,000. While some automotive mod companies linked to Hudson on his Instagram page relish his patronage, others are slamming the brakes on any association with the reckless driver’s exploits.
The city’s patience wore thin last week as Seattle City Attorney Ann Davison took legal action, demanding a default judgment against the daredevil driver. Hudson could be on the hook for not only his towering fines but also the taxpayer dollars squandered as a result of his failure to answer the city’s pleas.
Residents have lodged numerous complaints and police have issued warnings, tickets and reports to no avail. Hudson’s mother emailed the city in mid-May, insisting that steps were being taken to bring the car into compliance and under new ownership. Yet, a recent video on Hudson’s Instagram page contradicts these claims, showcasing masked antics that only fan the flames of local frustration.
The “racing grade” software bit is kinda hilarious and this is an extreme example, but it’s certainly not the only one. If it’s not Hellcats in Seattle it’s people in trucks “rolling coal” on electric cars:
If you’re not aware, rolling coal is using a (usually modified) diesel truck to spew as much particulate matter into the air. This is typically done by tweaking the engine to dump as much diesel into the cylinders as possible and, without enough air for proper combustion, the exhaust releases a big smokey plume that’s terrible for everyone. A kid in Texas tried to do it to a bunch of cyclists, accidentally collided with them, and sent two of them to the hospital.
The Hardigree Principle
Not to get too Andy Rooney on your ass, but when someone acts like a dummy in a Nissan Altima that’s easy to write off as a person being a dummy in a Nissan Altima, but when someone acts foolish in a modified car or a sports car it’s suddenly more ammo for those trying to declare all cars evil.
Now, Matt Hardigree is only human, don’t think I haven’t been through the same predicament. I get the appeal of being dumb in a car and I have, of course, been dumb in a car. But I’ve very specifically tried to do dumb shit in a way where, if I really screw up, I’m only annoying/hurting/inconveniencing myself. I’ve also tried to do it stealthily. If I’m in a bright orange Veyron I’m not going to go bombing down Broadway.
Weirdly, this seems to be the exact opposite of how people act. The more conspicuous the car the more conscious the activity.
This is why I’m proposing The Hardigree Principle, which states that the louder and flashier your car the harder you need to try to not be a jackass in public.
If you’ve got a heavily modified Pontiac Aztek with a bright purple zebra wrap and a bangin’ sound system then it’s on you to not blast Creed’s “With Arms Wide Open” outside the Children’s Hospital at 4:00 AM. If you’re a Creed Festival then or a race track or whatever, sure, have at it.
If your daily is a brand new 911 GT3 then, cool, good for you. Great car. Maybe try not to hoon it on city roads in the middle of a weekday, it’ll only end badly.
This isn’t to say that if you have a stock Dodge Neon you’re allowed to drive however you want. Always be safe, but the odd front-wheel-drive tire chirp from a spotlight isn’t going to grab the attention of the national news or doom car culture.
This Is What SLAB Culture Gets Right
Growing up in Houston I sort of grew up with SLAB cars. For those who don’t know, SLAB means Slow, Loud, and Bangin’ and refers to any car (though often older American cars) lowered and covered with bright candy paint, a huge subwoofer (with which to bang), and swangas (wheels with the giant elbows out).
Out of any context, they are about as obnoxious as any car could possibly be. But the “slow” in SLAB is important. While I regularly experienced SLAB cars in the wild and, on occasion, heard a few pop off with some Lil’ Keke in the middle of the HEB parking lot, I rarely had any issues.
Part of the reason is that so much money is put into these cars that it would be risky to drive fast with these wheels. Unfortunately, as pointed out in the film above, clout chasing has resulted in some street racing and other less-ideal behavior for social media.
To get a little more Andy Rooney, I do think social media has made this behavior worse by making it possible to grab a huge audience and make money by being more obnoxious with your car.
Ultimately, I think car culture is a good thing and for every one jackass annoying their neighbors for lols there are dozens of other helpful, well-meaning people who just like cars. It’s on the rest of us to do better personally and also to discourage our friends from being chodes so we don’t wind up with more car shows that think they need to ban whole classes of cars to survive.
To paraphrase Ben Franklin: It’s a nice car culture, if we can keep it.
I live in a small historic neighborhood on a scenic canyon road above Denver. I’m a huge car nut, as are most of the people in the neighborhood (Jeeps, off road Nissans, rotary Mazda, boosted BMW, supercharged Buicks, Ferrari, and Mercedes to name the more interesting cars parked in the driveways of the mere dozen or so homes that constitute the neighborhood). The sheer volume of asshats blasting through at incredible speeds (the speed limit is 35, and the sheriff’s department has clocked people well over 100 on multiple occasions), and incredible volumes (machine gun tunes, “track mode” exhausts, etc.) is absolutely maddening. I’d love if a more considerate culture were to take over personally, but the threat to all of us and our sources of joy is very real. I hope this takes off.
…I’d play “Speed Racer” all day if I could
But the Lord and my wife wouldn’t take it very good
So I hoon when I can and I work when I should…
Thank God I’m a car culture boy. (or girl).
I got my Beemer and I got my Jeep,
One’s on the lift and the other’s on the street.
…I’d play “Speed Racer” all day if I could
But the Lord and my wife wouldn’t take it very good
So I hoon when I can and I work when I should…
Thank God I’m a car culture boy. (or girl).
I got my Beemer and I got my Jeep,
One’s on the lift and the other’s on the street.
I’m starting to get a little old and grumpy with regards to modified cars on public roads. Perhaps it’s time for standards closer to the German regulations for road cars.
Big difference between modified cars, and cars modified for attention. Pops and bangs and obnoxiously loud exhausts are just for people that want to have people acknowledge them in any way.
I’m starting to get a little old and grumpy with regards to modified cars on public roads. Perhaps it’s time for standards closer to the German regulations for road cars.
Big difference between modified cars, and cars modified for attention. Pops and bangs and obnoxiously loud exhausts are just for people that want to have people acknowledge them in any way.
This Hellcat clown is a fucking menace and so are all of his ilk. I’m not going to claim that I’ve never driven like an idiot on public roads before but street racing, going 100+ in the middle of a city, takeovers, etc. are an absolute scourge on our society and they give the rest of us a bad name.
Maybe this is a bit of a privileged take since it’s not really a cheap hobby, but my stance is that you should just go to the track if you want to drive your car at its limits. It’s a controlled environment where you can legally and safely drive at higher speeds. I’m sure peoples’ experiences vary widely, but the track I go to is really welcoming and has events for people of every skill level.
You can go to a track attack day there for $100 and you don’t even need a helmet. I’m going to a high performance driver education day there tomorrow. It’s fun and I’ve made friends along the way. Anyway, social media is a goddamn scourge and it may well be the architect of the destruction of our society when all is said and done.
The fact that you can make hundreds of thousands of dollars being an idiot on social media is an immense societal failure. These clowns literally get rewarded for antisocial behavior, so why would they stop? This goes for more than just cars as well. The clout goblins will literally hurt themselves or others for that dopamine hit and potential paycheck.
And that’s more or less where I draw the line with cars or really any other hobby. If you can enjoy whatever you’re in to safely and it doesn’t put anyone else in harm’s way, then have at it. It’s your life, your body, and you can make your own choices.
But putting other people at risk in the name of your own pleasure is antisocial and selfish. Ripping your Hellcat around in a dense area is all fun and games until you wallop a cyclist. Shooting your gun is all fun and games until you forget to lock it up and someone who shouldn’t have it finds it. Rolling coal is hilarious, right up until the planet becomes uninhabitable due to climate change. Enjoying your music loudly is great until it interferes with your neighbor who’s a nurse that works night shifts and needs to sleep during the day.
Just fucking be nice to people and consider the needs of others. I don’t think it’s that hard. We are all on this rock together and as of now it’s the only place we can survive. I think that most people are inherently selfish to a degree, but I think the combination of social media and the pandemic have enabled antisocial behavior on a level we’re not used to. And it sucks.
Oh and don’t gate keep. Never gate keep. People that get turned away from certain communities tend to be the ones who say “I’ll show those assholes”, take their Challengers to a street takeover, and plow into a crowd.
This Hellcat clown is a fucking menace and so are all of his ilk. I’m not going to claim that I’ve never driven like an idiot on public roads before but street racing, going 100+ in the middle of a city, takeovers, etc. are an absolute scourge on our society and they give the rest of us a bad name.
Maybe this is a bit of a privileged take since it’s not really a cheap hobby, but my stance is that you should just go to the track if you want to drive your car at its limits. It’s a controlled environment where you can legally and safely drive at higher speeds. I’m sure peoples’ experiences vary widely, but the track I go to is really welcoming and has events for people of every skill level.
You can go to a track attack day there for $100 and you don’t even need a helmet. I’m going to a high performance driver education day there tomorrow. It’s fun and I’ve made friends along the way. Anyway, social media is a goddamn scourge and it may well be the architect of the destruction of our society when all is said and done.
The fact that you can make hundreds of thousands of dollars being an idiot on social media is an immense societal failure. These clowns literally get rewarded for antisocial behavior, so why would they stop? This goes for more than just cars as well. The clout goblins will literally hurt themselves or others for that dopamine hit and potential paycheck.
And that’s more or less where I draw the line with cars or really any other hobby. If you can enjoy whatever you’re in to safely and it doesn’t put anyone else in harm’s way, then have at it. It’s your life, your body, and you can make your own choices.
But putting other people at risk in the name of your own pleasure is antisocial and selfish. Ripping your Hellcat around in a dense area is all fun and games until you wallop a cyclist. Shooting your gun is all fun and games until you forget to lock it up and someone who shouldn’t have it finds it. Rolling coal is hilarious, right up until the planet becomes uninhabitable due to climate change. Enjoying your music loudly is great until it interferes with your neighbor who’s a nurse that works night shifts and needs to sleep during the day.
Just fucking be nice to people and consider the needs of others. I don’t think it’s that hard. We are all on this rock together and as of now it’s the only place we can survive. I think that most people are inherently selfish to a degree, but I think the combination of social media and the pandemic have enabled antisocial behavior on a level we’re not used to. And it sucks.
Oh and don’t gate keep. Never gate keep. People that get turned away from certain communities tend to be the ones who say “I’ll show those assholes”, take their Challengers to a street takeover, and plow into a crowd.
This is such an important take, Matt! My Miata is in the shop, so my ’68 4-4-2 is my only ride to work for two weeks. Yesterday, I had to drive it in Hampton Roads traffic with some nasty backups. The whole thing had my nerves shot as I’m idling in traffic, watching my temp gauge rise, and feeling all the negative effects of a hot muscle car while starting to sweat and smell like half-burnt gas.
But people still waved and have me thumbs up as they went by, and I always made sure to smile and wave back. Was I in the mood to? Nope. I was worried about my Olds. But at the same time I totally appreciate anyone who gets a smile out of seeing it on the road.
By the way, once the backup ended and the air was flowing again, things stayed nice and cool. As a matter of fact, while it did get hot, it never reached overheating territory. Dr. Oldsmobile knew what he was doing.
On the flip side, I was driving my Miata home a couple of weeks ago and some douche rolled coal on me for absolutely no reason. It’s not even legal in this state to have a (modern) diesel without a particulate filter, yet poof… there was the smoke. I smiled and waved at that guy, too.
How many fingers were involved in the wave to the truck? Hampton Roads has some interesting drivers for sure. I can’t wait to get my Miata and add another to the club! Seems like there are a lot of us in the area.
Ah the Monitor-Merrimac and Hampton Roads bridge tunnels. Yeah don’t miss those anymore. Good luck!
Thankfully I was at the Monitor-Merrimac. If this had happened waiting for the HRBT, I probably would have pulled off and sat for half an hour to let the car and the traffic cool down.
Still better than the old Mid-Town tunnel.
I get a decent amount of attention in my Miata, and in 8 years of ownership have never gotten a negative response on it. I once had a guy in a lifted truck lean out the window and say “YeeYee, brother”. And another time pulled up beside a truck of construction workers who were all staring. One rolled the window down and I fully expected a smart ass comment but instead we had a lovely conversation about the car. I think a lot of people respect or are indifferent to non-obnoxious cars around here.
This is such an important take, Matt! My Miata is in the shop, so my ’68 4-4-2 is my only ride to work for two weeks. Yesterday, I had to drive it in Hampton Roads traffic with some nasty backups. The whole thing had my nerves shot as I’m idling in traffic, watching my temp gauge rise, and feeling all the negative effects of a hot muscle car while starting to sweat and smell like half-burnt gas.
But people still waved and have me thumbs up as they went by, and I always made sure to smile and wave back. Was I in the mood to? Nope. I was worried about my Olds. But at the same time I totally appreciate anyone who gets a smile out of seeing it on the road.
By the way, once the backup ended and the air was flowing again, things stayed nice and cool. As a matter of fact, while it did get hot, it never reached overheating territory. Dr. Oldsmobile knew what he was doing.
On the flip side, I was driving my Miata home a couple of weeks ago and some douche rolled coal on me for absolutely no reason. It’s not even legal in this state to have a (modern) diesel without a particulate filter, yet poof… there was the smoke. I smiled and waved at that guy, too.
How many fingers were involved in the wave to the truck? Hampton Roads has some interesting drivers for sure. I can’t wait to get my Miata and add another to the club! Seems like there are a lot of us in the area.
Ah the Monitor-Merrimac and Hampton Roads bridge tunnels. Yeah don’t miss those anymore. Good luck!
Thankfully I was at the Monitor-Merrimac. If this had happened waiting for the HRBT, I probably would have pulled off and sat for half an hour to let the car and the traffic cool down.
Still better than the old Mid-Town tunnel.
I get a decent amount of attention in my Miata, and in 8 years of ownership have never gotten a negative response on it. I once had a guy in a lifted truck lean out the window and say “YeeYee, brother”. And another time pulled up beside a truck of construction workers who were all staring. One rolled the window down and I fully expected a smart ass comment but instead we had a lovely conversation about the car. I think a lot of people respect or are indifferent to non-obnoxious cars around here.
It is also just little things. On my local subreddit the other day, someone posted asking for a good place to practice “stick shift”.
In the responses is some jerk with something akin to “how about you call it by its proper name, manual transmission”.
If you love “manual transmissions” so much, then how about encouraging someone to use one, as opposed to checking them on proper terminology. Who cares?
Tribal signalling has replaced any form of inclusivity or ability to self-reflect outside of the group.
Everyone wants their groupthink to be the only thing in the room, and using “ackshually”s like that allow John Jagoff who’s got nothing but his little circle of friends who all agree manuals = good to affirm their choice.
It’s a natural thing to do, but it’s getting really tedious.
r/gatekeeping
It is also just little things. On my local subreddit the other day, someone posted asking for a good place to practice “stick shift”.
In the responses is some jerk with something akin to “how about you call it by its proper name, manual transmission”.
If you love “manual transmissions” so much, then how about encouraging someone to use one, as opposed to checking them on proper terminology. Who cares?
Tribal signalling has replaced any form of inclusivity or ability to self-reflect outside of the group.
Everyone wants their groupthink to be the only thing in the room, and using “ackshually”s like that allow John Jagoff who’s got nothing but his little circle of friends who all agree manuals = good to affirm their choice.
It’s a natural thing to do, but it’s getting really tedious.
r/gatekeeping
As somebody who grew up in the country, I never understood why people hated cars.
After 4 years living in a city, I felt like I completely understood.
Every day there was the almost constant background noise of cars with pop and crackle maps being driven way too fast around busy/residential areas.
One of my neighbors with a Mercedes GLA45 used to hoon around the neighborhood, often with another neighbor in a BMW 440i. We got so fed up with the noise that it ruined sitting outside our house or having the windows open, and I was constantly worried about pets getting run over.
After realizing how anti-social it was, I became very self conscious about how loud my cars were.
I now have the quietest exhausts I can find on my regularly-driven cars and always try to drive considerately when around other people or in residential places.
I still have fun out on quiet back roads when nobody else is around, but nobody needs to be hooning about around busy areas.
As somebody who grew up in the country, I never understood why people hated cars.
After 4 years living in a city, I felt like I completely understood.
Every day there was the almost constant background noise of cars with pop and crackle maps being driven way too fast around busy/residential areas.
One of my neighbors with a Mercedes GLA45 used to hoon around the neighborhood, often with another neighbor in a BMW 440i. We got so fed up with the noise that it ruined sitting outside our house or having the windows open, and I was constantly worried about pets getting run over.
After realizing how anti-social it was, I became very self conscious about how loud my cars were.
I now have the quietest exhausts I can find on my regularly-driven cars and always try to drive considerately when around other people or in residential places.
I still have fun out on quiet back roads when nobody else is around, but nobody needs to be hooning about around busy areas.
I had to LOL at the Andy Rooney reference. The yahoos who are obnoxious with their cars were going “ick” at girls in the 6th grade when Rooney died. If the cops would impound the offending cars and the DAs would impose a little social justice in the form of fines and a little time in the graybar hotel, it might discourage some of them.
I had to LOL at the Andy Rooney reference. The yahoos who are obnoxious with their cars were going “ick” at girls in the 6th grade when Rooney died. If the cops would impound the offending cars and the DAs would impose a little social justice in the form of fines and a little time in the graybar hotel, it might discourage some of them.
I drive with my windows down and the radio on. I turn the volume down when going through neighbourhoods and at stoplights (partially because I know it’s annoying to many to hear nu-metal in 2024 and partially so I can hear emergency vehicles or even disasters before they occur). If I’m driving a manual and I’m not out in the middle of nowhere I shift into the highest gear possible without stalling (or slowing uphill) so my RPMs are low and my engine’s not loud. I use turn signals even at dedicated turn lanes and add-on lanes. I don’t rocket forward the moment the light turns green. I don’t keep peeking into the oncoming lane in anticipation of a pass just because there’s a semi-truck in front of me.
And yet if you’ve ever seen me drive on deserted mountain roads during one of the nights where I just want to relax you’d think I was an asshole who cuts people off and races between stoplights with how little I brake and how much speed I carry going into those winding mountain turns. Even still I don’t break the speed limit, I just try and see how good my car control is and how smooth I can be without braking. Thankfully I live out in the middle of nowhere and choose remote roads so that if I let loose and things go wrong the only things that are going to be hurt are some of the millions of trees lining the road. Possibly myself and my wallet if I survive tumbling hundreds of feet down the mountainside.
My point being, the things you do with your car that others see as antisocial are precisely because you’re doing those things around other people. If it’s really about satisfying yourself and not feeding into vanity or insecurity about your self image then you wouldn’t do them around other people.
… I say, having typed all of this for the entire commentariat to read…
This summarizes it perfectly!
Basically, do what you want when nobody is around, but please don’t inflict it on other people.
I drive with my windows down and the radio on. I turn the volume down when going through neighbourhoods and at stoplights (partially because I know it’s annoying to many to hear nu-metal in 2024 and partially so I can hear emergency vehicles or even disasters before they occur). If I’m driving a manual and I’m not out in the middle of nowhere I shift into the highest gear possible without stalling (or slowing uphill) so my RPMs are low and my engine’s not loud. I use turn signals even at dedicated turn lanes and add-on lanes. I don’t rocket forward the moment the light turns green. I don’t keep peeking into the oncoming lane in anticipation of a pass just because there’s a semi-truck in front of me.
And yet if you’ve ever seen me drive on deserted mountain roads during one of the nights where I just want to relax you’d think I was an asshole who cuts people off and races between stoplights with how little I brake and how much speed I carry going into those winding mountain turns. Even still I don’t break the speed limit, I just try and see how good my car control is and how smooth I can be without braking. Thankfully I live out in the middle of nowhere and choose remote roads so that if I let loose and things go wrong the only things that are going to be hurt are some of the millions of trees lining the road. Possibly myself and my wallet if I survive tumbling hundreds of feet down the mountainside.
My point being, the things you do with your car that others see as antisocial are precisely because you’re doing those things around other people. If it’s really about satisfying yourself and not feeding into vanity or insecurity about your self image then you wouldn’t do them around other people.
… I say, having typed all of this for the entire commentariat to read…
This summarizes it perfectly!
Basically, do what you want when nobody is around, but please don’t inflict it on other people.
ugly duckling had it right
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tQWMUpq2cc
ugly duckling had it right
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tQWMUpq2cc
Gatekeeping stuff is annoying in the scene. Thankfully the few local things I tend to make it to are very enthusiast oriented, and not 20somethings taking over parking lots then streets then whatever.
The street race folks are really effing it up, and the takeover folks, jackasses the lot.
Also noticed a lot of these lately, the crotch rocket with no plates driving absolutely unsafely at absurd speeds. I’ve seen more crazy driving on the streets since the pandemic than during my entire driving career before that.
Gatekeeping stuff is annoying in the scene. Thankfully the few local things I tend to make it to are very enthusiast oriented, and not 20somethings taking over parking lots then streets then whatever.
The street race folks are really effing it up, and the takeover folks, jackasses the lot.
Also noticed a lot of these lately, the crotch rocket with no plates driving absolutely unsafely at absurd speeds. I’ve seen more crazy driving on the streets since the pandemic than during my entire driving career before that.
I mean, that subreddit isn’t totally wrong; we were wrong to let the 1940s/50s ideal of cars = freedom all but kill off every other option for getting around. I’m convinced at least half of the people driving do so only as a necessity and wouldn’t do so if they had the choice. Other people just don’t have the psychological makeup to operate anything larger/faster than a 10-speed bicycle; either they are too timid and drive far more cautiously than the flow of traffic can safely allow or they’re too selfish, treating every other vehicle/driver on the road as some kind of obstacle.
If we had better transit, the former group would have the option of choosing not to drive without the problem of dealing with subpar transit or relying on others to get around. The latter group could be barred from driving by higher licensing standards and stricter enforcement of traffic laws. And we’d have less traffic, so fewer accidents. Everybody wins!
Unfortunately, we’ve let the automotive sector grow to a significant part of our economy, so any large contraction in too short a time would likely mean a lot of people losing their jobs, and probably not the C-suite execs.
Of course, I’m primarily talking the US here. Other countries have managed to provide transit options while still having a decent automotive infrastructure/enthusiast scene, so why can’t we? And please don’t give me that old “the US is too big for transit” story. That can work for high speed rail, not transit.
Automobiles as an industry (and the infrastructure behind it) literally made the US what it is today. I don’t see any one period of time where it hasn’t been beneficial (shout out to the Malaise era for helping guide the emissions ship to at least where it is today). The US is vast. Like huge. It was also very less populated when the 20s-50s happened. Have you ever driven across it? I’ve taken many half trips and although I’m absolutely down for a road trip, I’m also more content flying. We are a very big spiderweb of communities, Having grown up in rural Nebraska and many years spent living in Northern Iowa/ Southern Minnesota, there is a zero chance of connecting people better than the automobile. Until we have Great Depression #2 there is just no way you will convince America to pay for not only their current automobile and taxes for infrastructure, but the cost for this, too. And as much anti-war I am I wouldn’t touch the Defense budget. It’s not a bad back pocket infrastructure panic button if we’re being honest.
Remember, the EU started as individual countries that morphed into the EU. They created mass transit for several reasons: ancient cities aren’t really designed for automobiles, affordability of automobiles after WW2 (America was very very prosperous from that), and each country was also very reliant on each other. US State and Federal economics are vastly different in this aspect, particularly after the Depression and war effort.
As a resident of DC, I am all for public transportation (hello Metro and buses)! But overall this countries rural/urban sprawl doesn’t really work so much.
Automobiles as the only viable means of personal transport in the USA was a choice pushed by automakers and adopted by the government in the 1950s, and one that has held the USA back from being even greater than it is.
The USA was not built for cars. The infrastructure and manufacturing capacity in the USA that won WWII was largely not for cars. It was for trains and ships and all manner of machinery. We had a cross-country rail network that let goods and people flow freely and efficiently across the country.
On the local scale, the cities were not made for cars, either. There were streetcars in almost every city; even small ones that today may have little to no bus service. In large part, those cities and the vibrant communities within them were literally bulldozed to build highways and parking lots, which greatly contributed to the downturn of urban areas in the decades that followed. And the streetcars? Literally bought out by the automotive companies so they could shut them down to drive demand for their automobiles.
The resulting sprawl caused by restrictive zoning, parking minimums, and failure to fund almost any infrastructure that wasn’t about moving cars has deeply scarred the landscape and infrastructure of America; resulting in higher costs for everything due to the huge direct and indirect costs of car infrastructure compared to traditional mixed development.
Just the spacing required for exclusive car access to businesses easily doubles or triples the amount of real estate taken up by a development – yet it only increases the taxable value by a tiny fraction of that. Then there’s the cost of building all that parking, and the added length of utilities, the snow removal, maintenance, etc., etc. All of that had to be baked into what we pay in taxes or for goods and services from a business.
Only in the last couple of decades has a sizeable chunk of the population come to understand just how much of a mistake this exclusive focus on car infrastructure was. Not only does it make things worse for pedestrians, cyclists, and transit users, but it actually makes things worse for drivers. The stroads that have developed in the USA to service car-centric business are the absolute worst roads to drive on, the least safe, and full of people who don’t even care about driving, so they’re barely even paying attention to what is going on around them.
Let’s talk a little about train service in Minnesota in 1962. There was service at least 3x daily between Minneapolis and Duluth, Fargo, and Chicago. There was daily service to International Falls, and numerous other cities within Minnesota. And that was with 3.5 million people residing in Minnesota, compared to 5.7 million today. Today, there’s just daily service to Fargo and Chicago, and nothing else.
The decision to subsidize car infrastructure so heavily, and shape government policy to force car-friendly development, is what led to that change, not any intrinsic superiority of automobiles.
As both a car enthusiast and an urbanist, I would love to have balanced town and city development that lets people who can’t, or don’t want, or don’t need to drive to have viable transport alternatives that don’t involve them risking life and limb to exercise. The resulting changes in infrastructure would make it not only easier to walk or ride a bike or take transit, but faster and easier to drive, due to reduced traffic and improved traffic flow.
Exactly. It’s not black and white, and it was odd seeing the description of what actually happened (cities made for cars, huge development of suburbs) being dismissed as some sort of anti car conspiracy story.
Thanks for your comment.
I mean, that subreddit isn’t totally wrong; we were wrong to let the 1940s/50s ideal of cars = freedom all but kill off every other option for getting around. I’m convinced at least half of the people driving do so only as a necessity and wouldn’t do so if they had the choice. Other people just don’t have the psychological makeup to operate anything larger/faster than a 10-speed bicycle; either they are too timid and drive far more cautiously than the flow of traffic can safely allow or they’re too selfish, treating every other vehicle/driver on the road as some kind of obstacle.
If we had better transit, the former group would have the option of choosing not to drive without the problem of dealing with subpar transit or relying on others to get around. The latter group could be barred from driving by higher licensing standards and stricter enforcement of traffic laws. And we’d have less traffic, so fewer accidents. Everybody wins!
Unfortunately, we’ve let the automotive sector grow to a significant part of our economy, so any large contraction in too short a time would likely mean a lot of people losing their jobs, and probably not the C-suite execs.
Of course, I’m primarily talking the US here. Other countries have managed to provide transit options while still having a decent automotive infrastructure/enthusiast scene, so why can’t we? And please don’t give me that old “the US is too big for transit” story. That can work for high speed rail, not transit.
Automobiles as an industry (and the infrastructure behind it) literally made the US what it is today. I don’t see any one period of time where it hasn’t been beneficial (shout out to the Malaise era for helping guide the emissions ship to at least where it is today). The US is vast. Like huge. It was also very less populated when the 20s-50s happened. Have you ever driven across it? I’ve taken many half trips and although I’m absolutely down for a road trip, I’m also more content flying. We are a very big spiderweb of communities, Having grown up in rural Nebraska and many years spent living in Northern Iowa/ Southern Minnesota, there is a zero chance of connecting people better than the automobile. Until we have Great Depression #2 there is just no way you will convince America to pay for not only their current automobile and taxes for infrastructure, but the cost for this, too. And as much anti-war I am I wouldn’t touch the Defense budget. It’s not a bad back pocket infrastructure panic button if we’re being honest.
Remember, the EU started as individual countries that morphed into the EU. They created mass transit for several reasons: ancient cities aren’t really designed for automobiles, affordability of automobiles after WW2 (America was very very prosperous from that), and each country was also very reliant on each other. US State and Federal economics are vastly different in this aspect, particularly after the Depression and war effort.
As a resident of DC, I am all for public transportation (hello Metro and buses)! But overall this countries rural/urban sprawl doesn’t really work so much.
Automobiles as the only viable means of personal transport in the USA was a choice pushed by automakers and adopted by the government in the 1950s, and one that has held the USA back from being even greater than it is.
The USA was not built for cars. The infrastructure and manufacturing capacity in the USA that won WWII was largely not for cars. It was for trains and ships and all manner of machinery. We had a cross-country rail network that let goods and people flow freely and efficiently across the country.
On the local scale, the cities were not made for cars, either. There were streetcars in almost every city; even small ones that today may have little to no bus service. In large part, those cities and the vibrant communities within them were literally bulldozed to build highways and parking lots, which greatly contributed to the downturn of urban areas in the decades that followed. And the streetcars? Literally bought out by the automotive companies so they could shut them down to drive demand for their automobiles.
The resulting sprawl caused by restrictive zoning, parking minimums, and failure to fund almost any infrastructure that wasn’t about moving cars has deeply scarred the landscape and infrastructure of America; resulting in higher costs for everything due to the huge direct and indirect costs of car infrastructure compared to traditional mixed development.
Just the spacing required for exclusive car access to businesses easily doubles or triples the amount of real estate taken up by a development – yet it only increases the taxable value by a tiny fraction of that. Then there’s the cost of building all that parking, and the added length of utilities, the snow removal, maintenance, etc., etc. All of that had to be baked into what we pay in taxes or for goods and services from a business.
Only in the last couple of decades has a sizeable chunk of the population come to understand just how much of a mistake this exclusive focus on car infrastructure was. Not only does it make things worse for pedestrians, cyclists, and transit users, but it actually makes things worse for drivers. The stroads that have developed in the USA to service car-centric business are the absolute worst roads to drive on, the least safe, and full of people who don’t even care about driving, so they’re barely even paying attention to what is going on around them.
Let’s talk a little about train service in Minnesota in 1962. There was service at least 3x daily between Minneapolis and Duluth, Fargo, and Chicago. There was daily service to International Falls, and numerous other cities within Minnesota. And that was with 3.5 million people residing in Minnesota, compared to 5.7 million today. Today, there’s just daily service to Fargo and Chicago, and nothing else.
The decision to subsidize car infrastructure so heavily, and shape government policy to force car-friendly development, is what led to that change, not any intrinsic superiority of automobiles.
As both a car enthusiast and an urbanist, I would love to have balanced town and city development that lets people who can’t, or don’t want, or don’t need to drive to have viable transport alternatives that don’t involve them risking life and limb to exercise. The resulting changes in infrastructure would make it not only easier to walk or ride a bike or take transit, but faster and easier to drive, due to reduced traffic and improved traffic flow.
Exactly. It’s not black and white, and it was odd seeing the description of what actually happened (cities made for cars, huge development of suburbs) being dismissed as some sort of anti car conspiracy story.
Thanks for your comment.
I am a lot more aware of how am I driving now I have a bright yellow BRZ than when I was in my silver Volvo wagon. Things to keep in mind. And yeah, I’m still confused about what the positives of social media are supposed to be again????
I am a lot more aware of how am I driving now I have a bright yellow BRZ than when I was in my silver Volvo wagon. Things to keep in mind. And yeah, I’m still confused about what the positives of social media are supposed to be again????