My favorite movie in the Rocky franchise is the fourth one. You know, the one where he fights the Soviet superman who killed his friend. Even after all of these decades—including some legitimately good and not-’80s-cheeseball entries like Michael B. Jordan’s Creed films—Rocky training in the wilderness so he can personally defeat communism is still a consistent Friday night go-to move at my house.
There’s a scene in the climactic bout when Russian boxer Ivan Drago—depicted, until then, as an almost inhumanly unbeatable fighter—takes a bad cut to the eye from Rocky. That’s when starts to realize that for all his pounding and hulking size, he’s not really getting anywhere against Rocky; “He is like a piece of iron,” Drago says as they both go into the ring for another round. And that’s the crucial moment in the film: the one where Drago finally realizes he may just be in over his head.
That is what it’s like to try and use any gasoline in the 2023 Toyota Prius Prime. Long respected by hypermilers, commuters and the Save The Earth crowd for its miserly fuel economy, the unexpectedly sleek and sexy new Prius is an absolute champion at saving gas—and you could make a case that it’s the best car in the Toyota lineup right now.
The Basics
Rebooted late last year, to the surprise of all involved, with aggressive new styling and revised driving dynamics, the fifth-generation Prius has transformed from an object of enthusiast scorn to a machine that demands respect. Earlier this summer, I spent a week in a Prius Prime XSE: the middle trim level of the plug-in hybrid version (the non-Prime Prii are standard hybrids that do not have plugs.)
Price: XSE Premium Starting MSRP: $39,170; as-tested, $41,875*
Horsepower: 220 combined system
Engine: 2.0-liter four-cylinder
Battery: 13.6 kWh
EPA Range: 50/47/48 (city/highway/combined, Toyota estimate)
Drive: Front-wheel-drive
Curb Weight: 3,516 lbs
Body Style: Compact four-door hatchback
*Pre-production prototype tested. Prices are estimated and via Toyota.
How Does It Look?
Great! It looks great. I don’t have much to add here that hasn’t already been written elsewhere, but the new Prius is objectively a win for Toyota’s design team. It even comes in some fun colors for a change, like Supersonic Red or this almost matte-looking Guardian Gray. Sadly, the new Prius’ best color, Maximum Yellow, isn’t an option for U.S. buyers. What a shame that is.
But it’s not surprising the design is cool, when you think about it; the Prius has always represented a master class in understated aerodynamics in its relentless pursuit of fuel economy. Granted, the new 2023 Prius actually has a slightly worse drag coefficient than its predecessor, but it’s so much less dowdy and robotic-looking that absolutely nobody is going to care. But it’s still almost supercar-grade with a drag coefficient of just 0.27.
The Prius does all of this while keeping its compact dimensions. It’s only about an inch longer and wider than the previous car, and about two inches lower overall, which speaks to the more sporting pretenses Toyota sought to instill this time. I really love the overall shape, the short overhangs, that aggressive front end and the horizontal light bar out back.
These days you could argue the Prius is Toyota’s flagship or even halo car: the standard-bearer for its vaunted hybrid system and more in-house than the BMW-sourced, Austrian-built Supra is. At last, the Prius has the looks to back that positioning up.
How’s The Interior?
Much of the rest of the auto industry is chasing the Tesla playbook with “green” cars these days—lots of touchscreens and a focus on minimalism to simultaneously emphasize tech and cut costs. By contrast, the new Prius feels like Toyota’s designers and engineers were explicitly told to double down on what they’ve always done while modernizing things in the process.
The result is a car that feels reasonably high-tech and built to serve its fuel-sipping mission but doesn’t fall victim to too many current trends. I can sum this up with one word: buttons. The 2023 Prius has a good amount of them, and they are welcome here. The steering wheel and climate controls all offer fantastic and intuitive physical controls, with a pleasing design to go with them. Everything here feels pretty high-quality, too. It’s not a Lexus, per se, but it’s one of the nicer Toyotas you can buy.
But it’s not completely old-school. You could never say that about my tester’s 12.3-inch touchscreen, which is huge by modern standards but thankfully positioned in a more landscape position (the vertically oriented big portrait screens do less for me.)
I’d say Toyota’s infotainment and software game is getting better these days—something I definitely couldn’t say in the 2010s—but I still used Apple CarPlay the vast majority of the time here. Thankfully, it and Android Auto are available via a wireless connection, which you still cannot say of things like Hyundai’s current electric vehicles.
Also, major points to Toyota for finally moving the main display unit above the steering wheel, in front of the driver, and not shoving it into a bar-thing at the top-center of the dashboard. It’s easier to read and a very clear, intuitive display in its own right.
What’s It Like To Drive?
As good as it looks, here’s where the Prius most deserves its Hybrid Rocky status—small but unbeatable, capable of sustaining a franchise for decades, and a winner despite always being the underdog somehow.
We’ll start with some context. We—and by that I mean both enthusiasts and normal commuters—do not expect a great driving experience from the Prius. When I moved to Washington D.C. some years ago and didn’t have a car at first (something we rectified in quick order by getting a Mini Cooper S), I often used the Zipcar car-sharing service. If I was lucky, I’d be able to snag an Audi A3 hatchback, which is basically a Volkswagen GTI in a blazer. But most of the time, I got stuck in a third-generation Prius.
As a Prius should be, it was phenomenal at saving gas; that’s the entire point. It was also a slow, unresponsive, almost narcoleptic machine, allergic to any demand for acceleration—which I occasionally did need even in D.C.’s abysmal city and highway traffic. It was a pure commuter car, a means to an end; it had 50 mpg combined and that was the point.
It’s a very different story for the new Prius Prime, which has clearly spent some time chopping wood and running up mountains since its last go-round. In Prime form, this compact plug-in hybrid packs 220 combined system horsepower, nearly 100 up from its predecessor and 26 hp from the standard non-plug Prius.
That output comes from a 2.0-liter Atkinson-cycle four-cylinder engine good for 150 horsepower, and the rest comes from the electrical setup powered by a 13.6-kWh battery. That’s a dual-motor system, one for the drive wheels, one for the planetary gearbox. The result: Car and Driver’s instrumented tests yielded a zero to 60 mph time of 6.7 seconds, which is quite respectable—and a marked improvement over the old days.
Now, despite having almost as much total horsepower as my old Subaru WRX, the Prius Prime is not fast. In the “hybrid vs. EV” debate, acceleration falls pretty firmly in the latter camp. But the Prius Prime does feel quick, more so than I expected. My week of testing involved mostly Brooklyn city driving and errand-running, including a trip to Rockaway Beach. In both settings I was surprised at how punchy the Prius Prime is—it’s great at delivering that no-nonsense electric torque that makes passing a breeze. In short bursts, this thing can move better than you’d think. (As a downside, that engine sounds quite industrial. But I’ve found few modern four-cylinder motors to be terribly pleasing to the ear at all, and engine sounds period are probably on the way out.)
It’s a decent little handler, too. That compact size, short nose and small steering wheel all work together to craft a hybrid that feels pretty agile. Toyota has said its engineers worked to improve the chassis, weight and center of gravity with this new Prius, and all of it shows. Whereas the old Prius was a car I respected but generally loathed driving, I actually looked forward to my time in this little gray tester.
I looked forward! To driving! A Toyota Prius! What fascinating times we find ourselves in.
But you’re not really driving a Prius for fun, right? You’re driving it to save gas. And that’s where this thing still shines the most. The Prius Prime is rated at a very impressive 50 mpg city and 47 mpg highway; I averaged around 48 mpg for my week of testing. Best of all, the Prius Prime offers up to 44 miles of all-electric range, or 39 miles on my XSE thanks to its bigger tires.
The fuel-saving may have been helped by this tester’s solar panel roof, a $610 option that allows some electric accessories like the air conditioner, and the battery itself, to get some juice from the sun. Motor Trend’s testing and optimistic revealed it could add as much as four miles of daily range to the car, though they debated whether it’s worth the cost or not; I think I’d spring for it.
All told, in a week of normal driving—again, mostly short trips, errands and one medium-length drive to the coast—I just didn’t really use gas in the damn thing. At all. Almost no matter how hard I tried. I plugged it in once at a street Level 2 charger to juice up the battery, but I don’t even think I cracked an eighth of a tank before I handed this car back to the press fleet folks.
Just know that the Prius Prime does not have the rapid-fire charging times that many modern EVs do; Toyota says it’ll get fully juiced in four hours on a Level 2 charger, or 11 hours on a standard wall outlet. Then again, being a hybrid, you could argue fast charging just isn’t needed here.
Does The Prius Still Matter?
I chose Rocky IV as an analog for this car for a reason. If this thing is the car version of the fictional boxing champ, I wondered about its mid-career relevance in a world that’s increasingly fully electric. The Prius smacks of effort in a way that the bZ4x, with its awkward name and questionable build quality, does not. Moreover, the Prius proudly remains a compact car in an SUV and truck world. It’s as if Toyota kept evolving a car central to its company thesis, agnostic of so many modern trends—screen dominance, SUV supremacy, the move to battery power.
So did Toyota make the right call here? When it comes to hybrid technology, I believe so. I too have wondered if Toyota’s previous administration got the future all wrong. But as the year went on and EV adoption turned out not to be a smooth upward curve, the value of hybrids in reducing gas use and emissions has become all the more apparent. It’s why Toyota’s applying the same hybrid systems to its new trucks and SUVs, like the Tacoma and Land Cruiser. That’s impressive to see. I’ve had a record number of pals and family members ask me for hybrid recommendations this year, many of them saying they can’t buy another fully gasoline car again; wildfire smoke blanketing your city will do that. We will need hybrid cars for a long time to come in this race to reduce car emissions.
That doesn’t fix the challenge facing the Prius itself. Sales of the car have been down for years, though I owe that more to its size (and for years, cheaper gas) than anything else. Even Toyota’s sales projections for this one are a fraction of the car’s heights a decade earlier. Frankly, I’m shocked Toyota hasn’t made a modern SUV version of the Prius brand yet, though that role is filled by the RAV4 Hybrid and Prime, Highlander Hybrid, Venza, Corolla Cross Hybrid and others.
Then again, I don’t have to question a car’s relevance to give it high marks. And I am giving those to the 2023 Prius Prime. It’s a fantastic car, easily the best Prius yet. Like other hybrids, it’s a fantastic option for those who, for whatever reason, aren’t ready or able to deal with the ongoing hurdles of full EV adoption yet—or just want a great car that doesn’t use much gas or create a lot of carbon emissions. That it looks and drives so well is merely an added bonus these days. I suspect a lot of 2023 Prius buyers will be repeat customers, but I hope some newcomers give it a look as well.
And it’s still a more affordable option. My Prime XSE tester was a pre-production prototype, but Toyota estimated it at $41,875. Not a bad option if running out and buying a $60,000 electric Hyundai and hunting for charging everywhere doesn’t seem palatable to you.
Three Things To Know About The 2023 Toyota Prius Prime XSE
- You actually won’t hate driving this Prius for a change
- You’ll be shocked how much money you don’t spend on gas
- It’s an EV alternative worth your attention
Does It Fulfill Its Purpose?
As a versatile, fuel-saving, low-emission hybrid, yes it does. And it shows Toyota’s still willing to put a ton of work into arguably its most notable car of the past 25 years.
What’s The Punctum Of The 2023 Toyota Prius Prime XSE?
Don’t count the hybrids out just yet. And the 2023 Prius Prime is still a champ that throws a formidable punch.
In California there are still some nuisances to going BEV. Our neighbors got a good deal on a new Bolt. They are trying to get a charger installed at their home. Issues so far: 1) new electrical code forces a new upgraded primary electrical panel (old one too close to gas meter, 2) wiring from main connection to electrical panel must be replaced (new code, again), 3) Pacific Gas & Electric lost the first application and has reset the clock, 4) PG&E says they may need to replace utility pole and there is no schedule for the work. They won’t give up, but it would stop me from going BEV should I need another auto, which may be never (I’m old and have low mileage 2001 Toyota Highlander and 2004 Acura TL).
Depending on how much you drive, an L1 charger can be enough for a BEV (or PHEV). It’ll still pick up 40-60 miles of range overnight, with nothing needed but a standard 15A socket.
PG&E drags their feet and has a system intentionally set up to cause delays and unnecessary frustration. When you call with a question, the person who answers never has access to that information. Emailed inquiries are answered a week or more later, or never at all.
Their public relations commercials are a bunch of hooie. Solar power and electric vehicle chargers are not good for their highly profitable business model.
So to stick it to the man, be persistent and patient, and keep on keeping on.
My 2017 Volt does the same things almost as well, and it was $14500 off lease with 20k miles and a hell of a lot of warranty left. The Prius is gorgeous, and a worthy successor, but I always feel like the Volt was there all along, and then Toyota does it oh NOW it’s a big deal. Bizarre.
It always felt that even GM didn’t want to spend the effort on the Volt.
All those I knew that owned one, wished GM came out with a refreshed one when it came time to replace it.
With Toyota, it’s more likely that it’ll be more than a flash in the pan.
Yeah I don’t know what I’m going to do when this one expires. I had a Gen1 now a Gen2. I hope there are more options out there. Maybe by the time I need one a RAV4 Prime won’t be totally unobtainable.
I’m driving a 2017 Prius Prime and have loved the 63 mpg. Any data on the longevity I can expect from the hybrid battery, repair or replacement costs? Am considering selling it to my sons family and investing in the 2023 reviewed here… especially if I can get a tax credit?
I hate the way it looks inside and out. I like EVs, but the minimalist look, boring asthetics is just not for me.
Sorry but when you compare the Financial incentives of buying a base model 3 and this the Tesla Model 3 will win especially in California. We’re not a whole lot more you can get a model y. It just makes more sense
There’s a whole lot of country out there outside of California that still doesn’t have adequate charging infrastructure, and won’t for some time. Never mind all the folks out there who don’t have access to home charging.
Is home charging feasible with a carport? Mainly re: “weather resistance”.
Not like it’s relevant for me since me and all my close friends and family live in apartments…nor could I afford an EV anyway…but I do ponder about the way forward for them in general.
Obviously garage is best-case scenario in general, but what about a carport, or just a driveway?
Also, I have zero interest in a Tesla for a variety of reasons. Having alternatives is a good thing.
I found the interior to be very economy-car. Not bad (because it’s brand new), but not nice by any stretch of the imagination. Simple, utilitarian, likely durable.
Can they please stop putting TV sets on the dash board.
Put this powertrain (or any of the hybrids they have) in a Maverick sized truck already
Maybe I have overly risk-averse friends, but most people I know say they aren’t ready to go with a BEV because of the range and charging considerations. They believe the PHEVs are the right compromise for now, so I would think there’s still a very solid market for the Prius.
As far as looks go, I’m not impressed. Kudos on the drag coefficient, but it just looks ungainly to me, at least in the pictures. I’ll withhold full judgement until I see one on the road, though. I initially disliked the Panamera based on its photos but found it much better looking in the flesh.
If you like the Panamera, I don’t think there’s much that you won’t like.
Range anxiety used to be a thing and is no more. If they have anxiety about going anywhere it’s because they have not properly researched what full battery electric vehicles are going to do for them. Couple that with the fact that there are numerous Financial incentives from the government, especially in california, and you are overpaying for a vehicle that would be superior performance and money savings over time
Sure. If you say so.
this is a wacko post, but thanks for stopping by
A 220HP hybrid Hilux would sell like ice cream at the beach during summer. Let’s go, Toyota, step it up!
How’s the visibility? When I rented an example of the previous gen I found the rear view mirror somewhere between annoying and dangerous in how it blocked my view out the windshield.
You get used to it, besides, there’s a backup camera or 5
I would think that depends on your height. In my old Corolla the rear view mirror will perfectly block the car in the intersection on the right. I’ve learned to duck my head to check.
I somehow feel like I want to see this tested for a week in Miami with the air conditioning on
What’s the concern? That occasionally the battery gets drained and it becomes just a regular Prius hybrid until the next charge?
Toyota has a testing facility in the Sonoran Desert outside of Phoenix so I’m sure mechanically it does just fine in extreme heat.
i’m a graphic designer, so I’ll find some way to alter the Pri in the bagging to Optim 😉
As a 2nd generation Chevy Volt owner, I approve of what Toyota has done with this generation of Prius Prime, and continue to be frustrated that Chevy didn’t continue developing the Voltec powertrain.
I would LOVE to see a Voltec powered Colorado or Equinox. My Volt is the best car I ever owned. It’s downright criminal they didn’t expand the tech
Reminds me of a TR7 hardtop that someone overinflated. https://www.classiccars4sale.net/images/uploads/aa/Triumph_TR78.jpg
Yeah, it looks good, and it was probably the right business decision for Toyota…but this is a betrayal of the “spirit” of prior ones. If that fuel economy is worse than gen 4 and (reportedly) it’s not as good for the headroom (front or back) or cargo space, then it’s a downgrade.
The whole point was the wonderful compromise of interior space and fuel economy. By shifting towards performance, I’m not really interested.
If/when I get crippling issues with my 2012 Prius v, I’m probably going to look for a gen 4. I’ve heard that’s the best generation for reliability.
That, or maybe a Venza from similar years.
(My friends/family and I mostly live in apartments, so I’m not really the target demographic for the plug-in variants.)
If you want to talk about the Betrayal of the spirit of Prior generation Prius vehicles, let’s talk about the fact that Toyota had the opportunity to evolve with battery electric and with their CEO decided to stagnate instead and now they are struggling to catch up the Tesla’s almost 50% market share in the US. They failed to innovate and THAT was the spirit of the prius.
I mean, a cursory search says EVs are still under 15% of the total car market. They have plenty of time to catch up.
And side note, I hate the name “Prius” for being so close to “priapism”
Do you mean to say “priapus”?
wow, that dashboard is so big it has its own dashboard. Or is that just an illusion from the camera angle?
For me, with the 44 mile range of the smaller wheeled version, this would be
electric-only at least 90% of the time.
I wonder how Hertz and other rental companies feel about BEV and PHEV. The old “drop it off empty, we’ll fill it back up, it’s more convenient” option on ICE cars is such a racket, but that’s slowly going away.
Come 2035 their feelings on the matter will be a moot point. They may as well for one welcome their hefty new overlords.
If the customer has to wait > 1 hour to recharge a BEV before returning (there might not even be a charger near where the rental return is), I would think many of them would just return with a not full battery and rather pay the fee.
Unless one of the new-model innovations is some kind of a catalytic converter theft-deterrent, I’d consider some other gas-minimizing vehicle. My neighbors had their Prius’s converter stolen last night (during the last of the SoCal storm, no less!). There are decent-range full-on BEVs for less than the price of this Prius — and which, of course, never use any gas at all, don’t need oil changes, don’t require any smog tests, and have no catalytic converter.
or don’t live in a hellscape where people hack off converters, but ok
Really? Just gonna call NY and CA hellscapes for people figuring out the weaknesses of ~15 year-old-cars with poorly designed and positioned catalytic converters?
I won’t even to pretend to know how CARB could be reworked to alleviate the problem, but the r/Prius subreddit is absolutely rife with people who’ve done nothing wrong and had theirs stolen, even some of the people proactive enough to have installed shields.
The idea that a car manufacturer could be called out (I’m not sure if that’s what you’re doing here or not) because a design 15 years ago makes a cat easily to nick doesn’t make a lot of sense.
This is a legit, no snark question. I get a discount (and knew I would when I got my current house) for having a driveway and for having a garage, likely due to stuff like this. And if I park in front of my house, my car will absolutely get hit. So…driveway. Is this discount not a thing elsewhere? Are these vehicles getting popped in the street/road or driveway?
My bad. No, I didn’t mean to “call them out”–not like government/etc. is enticing Toyota to try to remedy that kind of situation.
I honestly can’t tell you anything about insurance stuff. I have a 2012 Prius v, but I live in Pennsylvania in a reasonably safe area. I did get a 1.5″ lift kit installed and got a shield installed because of it, just in case. Living in an apartment renders the other questions moot for me.
Judging by r/Prius stories though, they’re definitely getting hit on residential streets and in driveways and such.
I too live in PA, though I suspect nowhere near you. I do know that you have to lock your cars up because the yutes will rifle through your car when you sleep…though that’s nothing new.
I can’t tell you how much of a discount I get, just that I do. Probably insignificant. But I do know that if I ad a way to post pics, I could show you how vehicular carnage is essentially localized to my house, and that of the neighbors on either side. Side street or driveway, or it’s getting popped. Likely where the insurance thing comes from.
It happens in the UK too.
It only takes a few people to decide it’s a good idea, and they can probably hit ten cars in an evening, so it doesn’t take long before hundreds of people are affected, which means many more people hear about it happening to their cousin’s aunt’s girlfriend’s mother’s dog, and then you have enough for the local press to call it an ‘epidemic’. All from a few people who have access to a sawzall, and someone to fence the stolen cats to.
They didn’t say they live in the deep south. They said they live in socal
This is a fair point
Where exactly would such a paradise be?
there are many such locations that by this definition could be considered “paradise”
Wow
Not sure where that utopia exists. I live in Caucasian acres where the bad neighborhoods are pretty decent. I know 2-3 people personally who have had the cat con hacked off their Priusess. I’m still mystified as to why you can’t go to the dealership and pay $1,500-2000 and buy a new converter, complete from flange to flange and just bolt it in. If the owner is lucky, the cretin who hacked off the converter, cut the O2 sensor downstream of the plug. So, why does it cost $1,000 labor to bolt in everything?
They moved the catalytic converter to a much harder to reach spot in the gen 4 ones, and also reworked to be less valuable. They’re still possible targets, but practically negligible compared to gen 2 and 3, which are more like “hey, here’s the most profitable converter to sell for scrap and you just need 60 seconds and a jack and sawzall”
Presumably (hopefully) it’s similarly hard to reach and not so valuable for gen 5.
With the federal tax credit a base Tesla Model 3 is only about $33,000. $41,000 for this car seems a bit high. Seems like it would be a good deal if there was not pure electrics for much less.
But this is a Toyota, so you won’t drive a truck through the panel gaps or support fascism.
Sigh….. I’m not the first person to explain this……. Buying a Tesla does not support fascism.
Buying a Tesla supports Elon Musk.
Elon Musk has lately been supporting fascism.
Ergo, Buying a Tesla supports fascism.
Just like buying a Ford during Henry Ford’s ownership would have supported antisemitism.
Musk is a fascist who supports fascists. Buying a Tesla makes him richer.
But Musk is a fascist.
How is this confusing?
Rust Buckets is one of those Tesla fanbois that will show up, from time to time, and throw in random gibberish about Teslas with a straight face, without admitting that Tesla has been lying about everything they do, at all times, for their whole existence, so people desperate to find an identity they can cling to can do so. Also: fascism.
With a Toyota you support the most BEV-opposed legacy car company. But you may have a point, nonetheless: if we continue with our current trend of ever accelerating carbon emissions, there would ultimately be an end to fascism (as well as all those other pesky isms).
Toyota is slow to adopt full electric vehicles…because they’re right
The snark is strong with this one
some days
Also, this is an up level trim, the base model Prius is like $28,500
A Model 3 is a fair competitor to this one (especially thanks to that outstanding charging network) but keep in mind there aren’t many pure EVs that can match that aggressive price.
and not be a complete pile at the same time
Except that, in my opinion anyway, this is significantly better than a Model 3. For the time being, until charging gets better, PHEVs are hands-down better. For my use case, I really can’t use a car that has to deal with charging infrastructure. The Prius looks like a great option.
Model 3 is literally the best answer to the charging problem because you get an adapter for the North American CCS and have access to the Tesla Supercharger network.
In a few years once the companies adopting the Tesla charging standard launch vehicles with that this argument goes away but this is literally the best BEV option for price and charging. Not the best option in my opinion (or at least far from my favorite) but the best at those two MAJOR things.
I’ve owed both. Model 3 is a far better car.
You’ve owned (past tense) the new Prius Prime and a Model 3?
But I don’t live in Irvine.
Base trim Prius is 28,000 before any tax credit.
If I were in the market for a new car… this would at the top of my list of cars to check out.
Plug-in hybrids make so much more sense to me that BEVs right now…
and until we solve the problems with batteries, they always will
Okay I fail to see the $17,000 in increased value over buying a Corolla hatch.
If Im going to settle for a small car, it better be affordable. $40k can buy you any number of nice crossovers that average around 30mpg if you want something boring. Or stretch it to about 45k and you are talking a Mustang GT, Hemi Dodge or a 700hp F150 with a factory warranty(fleet white with public works stickers on the door lol)
Who cross shops a Prius and a F150?
Autopians. We’re a strange bunch, it’s true.
He’s not saying that if you’re shopping for a Prius you might look at a 700hp f150. He’s saying that if you can spend $45k you’re not looking at a Prius at all.
Why not? I can spend that much and I wouldn’t be caught dead in american muscle or a f150.
But how else are you going to signal your status as an American macho toxic male? Oh, and ‘merica? Why do you hate ‘merica?
J/k, many fine people drive those cars. I’ve just had too recent of interactions with the bro-dozer types.
Well… I can prove that isn’t true…
It’s the top spec machine. The lower spec ones are much cheaper.
I’ve been holding back for months, not wanting to yuck someone else’s yum, but this thing is FUGLY. It is only “sleek and sexy” compared to prior generations. It may not make me cry Vlad the Impaler-style tears of blood like current BMW grills, or induce rage vomiting like 10th-gen Ford pickup taillights, but if this abomination ended up in my driveway I would have to go into protective custody to keep from driving the neighbor’s Bigfoot clone over it.
We will have to agree to disagree on that point. I quite like it.
Incorrect, this thing is hot
I personally love people so desperate for attention that they joke they would commit crimes because of how someone else’s car looks
I’m confused. You say all that but you think it looks better than prior generations?
I was already impressed with the redesign, but finding out someone is finally adding solar panels in a mainstream production car makes me even more impressed.
This non-plug variant makes sense for everyone without a garage or who resides in a part of the country with crap infrastructure for charging, which is most of the country.
My only question is what’s the view like from the driver’s seat with that wickedly raked windshield?
Hyundai started putting a solar roof on their Sonata hybrid as a an option as well. It makes sense especially when it comes to cooling or heating the cabin.
Don’t put this purely on the manufacturers. Android Auto wireless versus wired is mostly a purely arbitrary, capricious, and always vindictive decision made by Google. (Apple’s is “just give us money.” But it’s a lot of money.) Anger them in any fashion, and you will be banished to ‘wired only’ forever. Or if you’re too ‘downmarket’ in Google’s opinion. Or take your pick.
Spend 5 minutes with the system in last year’s Corolla, and you’ll long for an infotainment system that runs on Torch’s Commodore PET. Because at least that system would be more responsive and less buggy.
I knew a lot of first-gen Prius owners. And all of them bought it for the same set of reasons; FOMO, virtue signaling, and/or a desperate need for fuel mileage while logging over 30k miles a year.
Which is why so many Prii have been relegated to Lyft/Uber duties. There was no more FOMO. If you want to virtue signal, gotta buy an overpriced BEV. And it spent pretty much it’s entire life as a car that actively punished you for being ‘green.’ The interior was downright hateful. Leather? Hell no. Heated seats? LOL. You’ll take a central gauge pod so they could save on RHD vs LHD tooling costs, a shitty little ‘shifter’ that felt like it’d break in your hands, and as little interior room as they thought they could get away with.
The only reason to buy one was because you need a ‘good enough’ car to maybe not lose money playing illegal taxi driver. If you wanted a hybrid, you ran away from the Prius and instead bought the Corolla or Camry. Because at least then you got a working A/C. (The Prii A/C was badly undersized. For ‘efficiency.’) And you didn’t look like a weirdo.
Which is to say that Toyota themselves basically pissed away the things that sold it in the first place, by insisting for over a decade that it had to be the most miserly, cheap ass, penalty box they could build, and then slap a premium pricetag on it and a bunch of ridiculousness. Prius leases were 1.5-2.5x Camry lease prices.
Which also wasn’t helped by years of virtually guaranteed catastrophic engine failures. With Gen3’s, abrupt head gasket failure including hydrolock is a when-not-if. Gen1-Gen2 HV systems aged out and people quickly found out that those render the Prius crush-only. Don’t even bother getting a quote. And of course, if the HV system goes full fault, the car is completely locked up and will not start the engine or exit park. And only the dealer can fix it using special Toyota-only equipment, at a cost of over $1000, after you already replaced the HV pack.
Basically, they took that initial recipe for success, and said “YES MORE OF THAT” while ignoring year upon year of customer feedback and numerous major engineering deficiencies. Customers did not want and still do not want a penaltybox commuter no matter how much they care about fuel mileage.
Especially when the Camry Hybrid was posting better fuel mileage. (2020 Camry Hybird LE, 51/53. 2020 Prius, 54/50.)
And now at this point? Their dealer network is making Kia’s look good. Kia insists on a credit check before a test drive on a sticker priced Telluride. The local Toyota dealers try to hold your possible trade hostage as they tell you that it’s actually $10k above sticker and only if you finance through their special lender. While trying to charge an even higher premium for the Prius.
My local least-awful “SmartPath” dealer has a new thing where they list the cars at sticker, so $34k for a ’23 Prius XLE AWD. Except you can only have that price if you finance through Toyota, your credit score is 825+, you have an “approved” trade-in, and you agree in writing to buy it and start making payments before it even hits the lot.
And they think they’re gonna sell cars when the CJDR dealers are putting money on the hood before you even walk in the door, when Ford’s offering 2.9% APR for 60 on Escapes (Toyota is 4.99%+ for 60,) when Subaru’s offering 0.9% or $399/month on Solterras? HA!
Ok… but what about _this_ Prius? I would never have considered the previous generation. This one looks pretty compelling. The Camry, unless I’m wrong, does offer a plug-in model.
Are you going to spend $50,000+ for what amounts to entry-level wannabe-lux at a punitive interest rate when it doesn’t beat the Camry XSE Hybrid or the Corolla Hybrid, both of which you MIGHT be able to get somewhere near sticker?
Yeah. Didn’t think so.
No. I wouldn’t spend $50,000+. I would seriously consider it at MSRP. And I’d pay cash.
And correct me if I’m wrong… The Camry doesn’t offer a plug-in hybrid. That might not be important to you… but from the last year of driving a Volt… it is for me.
Curious, what don’t you like about gen 4? I’ve heard it’s the most mechanically reliable generation of them.
I like the extra 100hp.
Guess that makes sense if you’re used to the extra power. I drove a ’97 Econoline-150 for 7 years, and it turns out 5500lbs/215hp and 3500lbs/134hp work out to very similar acceleration, so it wasn’t an adjustment for me.
Maybe empty. How about when doing van things loaded up with heavy cargo?
I mean, it was a conversion van (7 passenger) and it didn’t have a tow hitch. The DJ and band equipment never weighed more than a few people. Even on vacations it handled fine with people, stuff, and a roof cargo carrier. Not like I timed the 0-60 in that condition but I don’t recall it feeling terribly different.
I suppose my point is, I’m not performance-focused with my vehicles (and I hope not to become that way), so a Prius being “slow” doesn’t bother me.
These days, it really seems like Toyota’s worst enemy is Toyota.
They’re so busy parading around their 6S, Lean-6, and DPPM metrics that they don’t realize the real-world difference in reliability between a Camry and a Civic is basically nil. They built a huge technological lead with the Prius but squandered it thinking nobody would ever catch up, and now Hyundai’s Ioniq Blue is cheaper and faster and more efficient than a Prius Eco, and BMW’s US sales are 25% hybridized compared to Toyota’s 22%. Despite their bluster, they’re getting beaten in sales volume for PHEVs, EVs, and even hydrogen. And all the while, Toyota keeps raising prices for the “privilege” of owning a Toyota, as if it’s aspirational to own a car from a company that gets more mediocre every year.
I have no doubt that Toyota could kick a considerable amount of ass, truly grandiose volumes of posterior, but first the company needs to snap back to reality.
I would say that the new generation of Prius Prime suggests they’re on the warpath, but uh… let’s not forget this is the same year they’ve released the Crown for $41k, a confusing mess that’s too big and too small at the same time. And also the Busy Forks which was untimely ripped from its mother’s womb, and presumably thanks to the limited gestation period didn’t have the time to develop a glovebox or a functional gauge cluster. So much of what Toyota’s doing lately just screams “designed by committee.”
there’s so much incorrect about this post that it boggles the mind. But let’s start with one truly wild thing you said: commenting on reliability between a Camry and Civic. Haven’t Toyota and Honda ALWAYS been considered on par with each other regarding reliability?
With the possible exception of the Telluride twins, all Kias (yep, an absolute) should be avoided at all times. Please don’t pretend you haven’t seen alllll the reasons for this. And that’s separate from the dealer experience, which is a BHPH paradise.
Similarly, you can’t begin your argument talking about good reliability AND then pivot to BMW sales numbers. BMW wishes they had reliability problems that Kia/Hyun has.
Now, this is an opinion of mine. But you did start that last paragraph about Toyota being on the warpath. With the current truck/SUV updates across their portfolio, I would agree, as do most people. The leadership change at the top suggests that they have indeed decided to change how they do things. Will they continue? Will sales support this? Remains to be seen.
I don’t think there’s anyone that would agree that recent designs would be design by committee…unless you’re a fanboi for some other brand you didn’t identify.
That’s a hot take on Kias. If nothing else take the best powertrain warranty in the industry at 10 years 100,000 mi. with a limited bumper to bumper warrant closer to 5 years 60,000 miles.
https://www.caranddriver.com/research/a33215854/warranty-for-kia/
IMO Kia/Hyundai have made great strides in the ’00s modelling toyota from the 90s and are making some truly compelling products.
This cannot be an actual and serious point about Kias. There is a backlog of cars/people waiting for engines because Kia/Hyun have so many to replace. They aren’t the only manufacturer with this issue…but this is a well-known thing. I don’t care about what their warranty is.
I completely agree that they are not the same company as they were in the 90’s, and that they have compelling stuff. At least…more compelling.
Kia is still a brand to avoid.
Most Toyotas will still run like new at 300,000 miles. Most Kias will be in the wrecking yard before half that many miles.
Ding ding ding.
Except it’s not even that simple. Because contrary to what the spamming Toyota fanboi troll claims, Toyota isn’t even competing. Period. They’re taking the stance of “we’re Toyota. Doesn’t matter how many recalls we have or lawsuits or anything. You’re gonna buy us because we’re Toyota.”
To say nothing of the lie that “it’s dealer bullshit!” Oh really? I had no idea the dealers were the ones setting the interest rates and promotions at Toyota Financial Services. Wow. I guess they must be way more powerful than we all imagined!
Among manufacturers where cars are sitting on lots because consumers can’t afford them, Toyota is charging the highest interest rates by far, and has the most uncompetitive lease promotions. Their leasing is downright offensive, in fact. And those are national promotions, natch.
Case in point: the Prius. Leasing an absolute base model – and I do mean zero boxes ticked – new Prius will cost you over $430 a month with $2000 down. For a $28,000 sticker. You have to be high and/or stupid to think that’s at all reasonable.
Prius Prime? $498 a month with over $3200 down for the base.
How about a buzzeraxethingy now that the wheels don’t fall off? $558/month on a no buyout clause, versus the Subaru Solterra at $399/month. Which is why I brought it up.
And let’s stack it up against the competition, much of which builds a better car at this point.
Corolla Hybrid LE (absolute base model.) MSRP $24,145, lease $390 month with $3040 down, finance at 5.99% for 60 or 6.49% for 72.
Hyundai Elanta Hybrid. Lease $369/month with $3499 down for Blue (MSRP $24,550,) or $441/mo with $3523 down for Limited (MSRP $29,150.) Finance at 4.99% for 60. Also cash on the hood for conquests.
Hyundai Sonata Hybrid. Lease $387/mo with $3499 down for Blue (MSRP $28,450.) Finance at 3.49% for 48, and $500 on the hood plus conquest cash.
Honda, who has always taken the same “fuck you, we’re mythically reliable, we don’t do deals” stance? $359/mo with $3699 down on Accord Hybrid (MSRP $31,345.) Finance at 3.9% APR for 48 months, 4.9% for 60. $500 on the hood for returning customers, $1000 for conquest customers.
And let’s expand it a bit.
BMW is offering 3.99% for 60 months or less for many models.
Ford is offering $389/mo with $4149 down on the Escape AWD 200A with cold weather here, and 2.9% APR for 60 months.
Hyundai Elantra Hybrid Limited ($29,150) for 60 with no money down gets you a 4.99% APR and will cost you $3,716 in interest for a total of $34,700.
The only offer Toyota has on the Prius LE AWD ($28,850) is 9.46% APR for 72. Which will cost you $9,069 in interest for a total price of $40,727.
We can go at this all day, but we have more than enough that any argument otherwise will consist of nothing but ad hominems. Toyota has made clear that they are high on their own supply. Their cars and pricing are not even remotely competitive in the current market; in fact, you have to be either a fanboi or inexcusably bad at math to think any Toyota is a ‘good deal.’
RootWrym… most of your posts I find to be well-reasoned and entertaining. This isn’t one of them.
You’re assuming a scenario that doesn’t apply to me… or many others. I don’t give a rat’s ass about Toyota financing. I’ll pay for my next car in cash.
I don’t care about the Corolla or Camry hybrids. Neither offer a plug-in option. The Prius does. I drive a Volt now… I’m sold on the value of a plug-in hybrid.
I see quite a few Prius Primes advertised in my area for $32-38K. I haven’t gone in to a dealer to verify… but I’m not seeing the “$50K” you’re mentioning.
I agree that Root is usually good stuff. Must be an off day
Still entertaining though!
The only accurate comparison of a vehicle’s cost is selling price vs. selling price. When a manufacturer decides to subvent the cost of a particular model it’s usually based on supply and rate of sales. The higher the days supply, the more likely they’ll offer discounts. A model in short supply usually never receives incentives. When they are, they’re incentivized several ways; rebates, low APR rates or low lease payments. A low APR requires the buyer to use the manufacturer’s lending arm and sometimes an alternate rebate is offered. As you can imagine, a low APR for 60 months on an Escalade requires a much higher participation than the same rate on an Equinox so GM is kicking in a lot more on the Escalade.
A low lease payment is manipulated several ways and cannot provide an accurate comparison unless you’re a pure payment buyer and always have a monthly payment. Here’s the lease calculation equation for you to ponder:
capitalized cost (selling price of car plus taxes, tags and acquisition fee
-minus down payment)
+ residual value ( a percentage of MSRP determined by the leasing company)
X money factor (the cost of funding but not an APR)
______
= monthly cost to finance
+
Capitalized cost
-residual
divided by the term
_________
= monthly depreciation
Cost to finance + depreciation = total monthly payment
Throw in annual mileage allowance which lowers the residual you now have 4 variables that affect payments which is why 2 different manufacturers with identically priced cars can advertise dramatically different lease payments.
this is a person who wanted to come here and tell a story about different cars not tested in this article
And this is a Toyota fanboi who wanted to troll.
Back to the lighting site with you, kiddo.
I don’t know what any of that means. But your posts are usually spot on. This one is a dumpster fire.
Do you truly not realize why other places are putting so much cash/APR on the hood? That would seem odd.
I dunno, the Hyundai/Kia models getting wireless Android Auto in their low trims of some models and not their high trims or higher models suggests the effect of being down market is not that big a factor. The licensing on different head units might be prohibitively expensive, but Google will take their money if they can.
Toyota dealerships really are terrible, though. They know that people will buy based on the reputation for reliability, and they don’t figure they need to do anything to earn that business.