With featherweight construction and manual steering, the Alfa Romeo 4C looks like a fun machine to pack with a weekend’s worth of stuff and take to the Blue Ridge Mountains, Poconos, canyons, or whichever geographical area near you has good roads. However, you may have to be careful if you want to bring a passenger because this carbon fiber machine might not be ready for them despite having a passenger seat with a seat belt and everything. Let me explain.
Just like pickup trucks, each and every passenger car sold in America has a payload capacity for the total permissible weight of passengers and luggage. Usually, a combination of structural and tire loading factors are the reasons behind these limits, and they normally accept a sensible amount of occupants and cargo. A new Camry is rated to carry 1,131 pounds, and even my Porsche Boxster is rated to carry 529 pounds, according to the sticker under the frunk lid.
In contrast, the Alfa Romeo 4C has a comically low payload capacity. For instance, this 2015 4C Launch Edition sold on Bring A Trailer displays a payload capacity of just 344 pounds and the later Spider models with the removable roof shave that absurdly low figure down further.
According to the CDC, the weight of an average American man aged 20 or older is 199.8 pounds, and the weight of an average American woman aged 20 or older is 170.8 pounds. Split the difference, and you end up with an average weight of 185.3 pounds. No big deal, right? Well, if you were to put two people of average weight in an Alfa Romeo 4C, they’d handily exceed the maximum payload capacity before we even split hairs about belt buckles and wallet construction adding ounces here and there.
Now, this seems somewhat important considering that the Alfa Romeo 4C has a carbon fiber tub, and unlike steel, carbon fiber doesn’t exactly have shape memory. You know how when you gently bend a piece of steel with your hands, it bounces back? This fancy plastic doesn’t exactly do that. Considering that replacing the carbon fiber tub — the structure that everything else bolts onto — would likely total the car, I certainly don’t feel like risking finding out the hard way what happens when you overload the vehicle for a prolonged amount of time.
Granted, it’s unlikely that any structural issues will arise from fitting two average-weight occupants into an Alfa Romeo 4C and continuing normal operation, but a more pertinent matter is liability should things go wrong. If anyone is injured in the event of a crash, insurers might cock an eyebrow if the car’s payload capacity was exceeded.
In any case, should you wish to take an Alfa Romeo 4C out for a weekend getaway with a passenger, you might want to use a scale as part of the planning process. Oh, and even if you don’t have access to an Alfa Romeo 4C, it probably isn’t a bad idea to take a quick look at the sticker on your vehicle detailing exactly how many pounds it can carry.
(Photo credits: Alfa Romeo, Bring A Trailer)
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Miata weight limit is 340 lbs. Pretty much always has been. That hasn’t stopped anyone.
Miata doesn’t use a Carbon Fiber tub though. i’d trust steel more even with minimal safety factor
That’s on you. Load capacity is load capacity regardless of the material it’s made from.
Both a steel Miata and a carbon 4C have a large safety factor in the chassis. As in, waaaaay more than 1.1x or whatever you’d be loading it to.
Second-gen Ford GT weight limit is 331 lbs. Which I suppose is more than enough for its likely usage of being trailered between climate-controlled garages as it gets passed around from one investor to another.
For the average American couple, Miata is NOT the answer.
That’s why we have two.
That’s wild! And somewhat unfortunate, in my eyes.
What I see is a perfect excuse to buy a 4C if you’re overweight. For inspiration.
Plenty of people buy undersized clothes as an inspiration to work out and lose weight, so as to be able to tell themselves, “I WILL fit in these clothes!”
The 4C is the automotive equivalent of a pair of 32W men’s pants.
Except most 32W mens pants are really 34 or 35W now and just labeled 32, its really annoying, the whole point of fixed sizes is supposed to be so you don’t have to try crap on at the store, should be grab and go, but not any more
And then you’ve got the jeans that have got a bit of spandex in them (or whatever), so their stretch factor at the waist is also significant. They’re just trying to accomodate that Friday night beer gut. 😉
What I see is a perfect excuse to buy a 4C if you’re overweight. For inspiration.
Plenty of people buy undersized clothes as an inspiration to work out and lose weight, so as to be able to tell themselves, “I WILL fit in these clothes!”
The 4C is the automotive equivalent of a pair of 32W men’s pants.
Except most 32W mens pants are really 34 or 35W now and just labeled 32, its really annoying, the whole point of fixed sizes is supposed to be so you don’t have to try crap on at the store, should be grab and go, but not any more
And then you’ve got the jeans that have got a bit of spandex in them (or whatever), so their stretch factor at the waist is also significant. They’re just trying to accomodate that Friday night beer gut. 😉
My Honda Element’s total payload capacity rated at 780 lbs, and it’s a four-seater with a large cargo area. That means an average weight of 178.5 lbs per passenger with 75lbs of stuff in the back.
So, yeah, not sure what’s up with these max weight ratings.
I suspect he manufacturer has to pass certain tests with the car loaded to GVWR, and so they lower the rating knowing damn well that the customer will just ignore it.
My Honda Element’s total payload capacity rated at 780 lbs, and it’s a four-seater with a large cargo area. That means an average weight of 178.5 lbs per passenger with 75lbs of stuff in the back.
So, yeah, not sure what’s up with these max weight ratings.
I suspect he manufacturer has to pass certain tests with the car loaded to GVWR, and so they lower the rating knowing damn well that the customer will just ignore it.
Woohoo! I am above average!
Finally, an honest person in this thread, lol.
Woohoo! I am above average!
Finally, an honest person in this thread, lol.
Considering that Alfa’s aren’t really known for their robustness and longevity, I’d think that exceeding the payload capacity is the least of your worries.
Hey, it’s not 1978 anymore. Sorry to burst your bubble, but troll through some euro used car sites and you’ll find find plenty of Alfa Romeos with very high mileages. Also, no apostrophe needed to pluralize a word.
Considering that Alfa’s aren’t really known for their robustness and longevity, I’d think that exceeding the payload capacity is the least of your worries.
Hey, it’s not 1978 anymore. Sorry to burst your bubble, but troll through some euro used car sites and you’ll find find plenty of Alfa Romeos with very high mileages. Also, no apostrophe needed to pluralize a word.
I had a Tacoma with a maximum payload of 800 lbs. It had a 6.5 foot bed, but if you filled it with anything denser than fiberglass insulation you were overweight.
I can put ~1500lb in my f150, but 1500lb of rocks looks like very little in an 8′ bed.
A few months ago, I had a discussion with somebody here in Autopian comments who was not a fan of the Maverick because it did not have a sufficient payload capacity to haul a bed completely full of dirt, level with the bedsides. He seemed surprised to find out that literally 0 pickups ever manufactured are capable of hauling a bed completely full of dirt. A 2024 F450 would be comically overloaded, by 3000lb, if you did so.
Yeah, you definitely have to be careful. I probably framed that wrong by saying “filled it”. What I really meant was that it was a disappointing payload rating and it’s easy to overestimate how much you can haul, especially when you put people in the cab, too.
I had a Tacoma with a maximum payload of 800 lbs. It had a 6.5 foot bed, but if you filled it with anything denser than fiberglass insulation you were overweight.
I can put ~1500lb in my f150, but 1500lb of rocks looks like very little in an 8′ bed.
A few months ago, I had a discussion with somebody here in Autopian comments who was not a fan of the Maverick because it did not have a sufficient payload capacity to haul a bed completely full of dirt, level with the bedsides. He seemed surprised to find out that literally 0 pickups ever manufactured are capable of hauling a bed completely full of dirt. A 2024 F450 would be comically overloaded, by 3000lb, if you did so.
Yeah, you definitely have to be careful. I probably framed that wrong by saying “filled it”. What I really meant was that it was a disappointing payload rating and it’s easy to overestimate how much you can haul, especially when you put people in the cab, too.
“Where have all the average people gone?”…
Roger Miller
Dang me.
Ba dip dip dip dip da bon bon bong.
(coincidently, the same sound an Alfa makes right before $5000 is deducted from your bank account)
yeah, but you might be king of the road in one of these
If it breaks down , you’ll have to stay in a trailer for sale or rent.
“Where have all the average people gone?”…
Roger Miller
Dang me.
Ba dip dip dip dip da bon bon bong.
(coincidently, the same sound an Alfa makes right before $5000 is deducted from your bank account)
yeah, but you might be king of the road in one of these
If it breaks down , you’ll have to stay in a trailer for sale or rent.
Does it come with a “No Fat Chicks” sticker for the passenger door?
No fat chicks, car will
scrapebreak.It should!
It’s a great excuse.
Does it come with a “No Fat Chicks” sticker for the passenger door?
No fat chicks, car will
scrapebreak.It should!
It’s a great excuse.
Wonder whether there are any that are worse. Lotus Elan S4: Max laden weight 900kg, unladen weight 694kg. So, usable load is 206 kg, or 453.2 lb. Compared to the 4C, built like a tank!
the real question is though, what Is the airspeed velocity of an unladen Elan?
Wonder whether there are any that are worse. Lotus Elan S4: Max laden weight 900kg, unladen weight 694kg. So, usable load is 206 kg, or 453.2 lb. Compared to the 4C, built like a tank!
the real question is though, what Is the airspeed velocity of an unladen Elan?
To be fair, this car is so small two average size Americans might struggle to fit in it. I’m not sure the low payload matters.
Have you ever sat in one though? I have, and it’s actually pretty spacious for people not too far above average size. I’m 5’10 and 210 lbs and fit in one pretty well, with plenty of headroom. I was surprised by how far the seats slid back.
I tried driving in one a few years ago and couldn’t get in the car. I’m 6’1″, but due to strange proportions my seated height is abnormally tall (similar to someone who is 6’6″ or taller). I have headroom issues in a lot of cars. It doesn’t help that my short legs prevent me from moving the seat back.
I recall the car having limited lateral room as well, though. I was around 300 lbs at the time, which probably didn’t help. I suppose I am a bit larger than average, but the 4C stands out as one of three cars I was literally unable to drive because of space issues (the other two being the Viper and the current Supra).
To be fair, this car is so small two average size Americans might struggle to fit in it. I’m not sure the low payload matters.
Have you ever sat in one though? I have, and it’s actually pretty spacious for people not too far above average size. I’m 5’10 and 210 lbs and fit in one pretty well, with plenty of headroom. I was surprised by how far the seats slid back.
I tried driving in one a few years ago and couldn’t get in the car. I’m 6’1″, but due to strange proportions my seated height is abnormally tall (similar to someone who is 6’6″ or taller). I have headroom issues in a lot of cars. It doesn’t help that my short legs prevent me from moving the seat back.
I recall the car having limited lateral room as well, though. I was around 300 lbs at the time, which probably didn’t help. I suppose I am a bit larger than average, but the 4C stands out as one of three cars I was literally unable to drive because of space issues (the other two being the Viper and the current Supra).
” carbon fiber doesn’t exactly have shape memory”
Huh?!?
Carbon fiber is popular for fishing rods, recurve, archery bows, skis, and I believe some automobile leaf springs, all of which depend on its excellent shape memory.
Carbon fibers ductility kind of sucks, and when it fails, it fails rather catastrophically, but really it’s all about shap memory.
Yeah, CFRP has excellent shape memory and also fatigue resistance. For this reason the 787 with its carbon structure has greater time between inspections for failures due to wing deflections compared to aluminum bodied aircraft. This would 100% be the material you would want this car to be made out of if it will often exceed its load rating (which is usually pretty conservative).
Glad I found someone else calling this out too. CFRP is often used because of its shape memory and large elastic deformation whilst maintaining high yield strength.
Unless you’re planning to visit the wreck of the Titanic.
Carbon composites have the tensile strength of carbon fibres but the compressive strength of resin.
Great for pressure vessels as long as the pressure is on the inside.
” carbon fiber doesn’t exactly have shape memory”
Huh?!?
Carbon fiber is popular for fishing rods, recurve, archery bows, skis, and I believe some automobile leaf springs, all of which depend on its excellent shape memory.
Carbon fibers ductility kind of sucks, and when it fails, it fails rather catastrophically, but really it’s all about shap memory.
Yeah, CFRP has excellent shape memory and also fatigue resistance. For this reason the 787 with its carbon structure has greater time between inspections for failures due to wing deflections compared to aluminum bodied aircraft. This would 100% be the material you would want this car to be made out of if it will often exceed its load rating (which is usually pretty conservative).
Glad I found someone else calling this out too. CFRP is often used because of its shape memory and large elastic deformation whilst maintaining high yield strength.
Unless you’re planning to visit the wreck of the Titanic.
Carbon composites have the tensile strength of carbon fibres but the compressive strength of resin.
Great for pressure vessels as long as the pressure is on the inside.
I don’t remember there being much width in the cabin anyway, so two adults of that size might not even fit simultaneously, especially with one trying to operate the steering wheel.
Yeah, the problem solves itself, two average Americans wouldn’t be able to physically squeeze themselves in there anyway
There are ways to hit 200 lbs without being wide. I’m 5’6 and a hair over 200 lbs, but my shoulders aren’t more than an inch wider than they were when I was 135 lbs. I’m not saying I look good, just that I’m not wide.
Two adults of what size? Plenty, and I mean plenty, of people weigh 172lb or more without being remotely wide.
I don’t remember there being much width in the cabin anyway, so two adults of that size might not even fit simultaneously, especially with one trying to operate the steering wheel.
Yeah, the problem solves itself, two average Americans wouldn’t be able to physically squeeze themselves in there anyway
There are ways to hit 200 lbs without being wide. I’m 5’6 and a hair over 200 lbs, but my shoulders aren’t more than an inch wider than they were when I was 135 lbs. I’m not saying I look good, just that I’m not wide.
Two adults of what size? Plenty, and I mean plenty, of people weigh 172lb or more without being remotely wide.
The low payload is the second-most ridiculous part of the 4C, behind the fact that it’s automatic only. If ever there was a car begging for a manual transmission, this would be in the running.
I’ve found it hilarious since Day 0 of the North American relaunch that Alfa focused on being the “driver’s choice” luxury brand to differentiate themselves, but they literally never offered a manual here
…yes, it annoys me also, but they don’t offer it because only about 10% of buyers would opt for one. It costs a lot to certify cars with different transmissions, so they don’t bother. Alfa Romeo isn’t not alone in this.
Then don’t focus on being the driver brand. There are cost sacrifices to be made when a brand makes this their focus. You’re making excuses for a very incoherent business plan. Their sales reflect the utter failure of it
Funny enough, I perused the 4C forums to see if anyone’s tried to add a manual to one, like a Fiat Punto or Alfa MiTo transmission, and all I found was some guy asking “will the gated manual from the R8 fit? I’m thinking I’ll go with that”, which didn’t give me much faith as 1. that’s a longitudinal transmission with a transfer case, 2. he also wanted to swap in an engine that made “at least 500hp” into the space that’s fully occupied by a 1.7L, and 3/4 of the posts on the thread were “DCT is faster why would you swap”. Seems like Alfa Romeo customers are just as clueless as the company.
Meanwhile my regular Insight weighs 600lbs less and has a manual transmission. Kinda dont get the 4C.
Exactly. You’re comparing an Insight to a 4C.
This was an extremely amusing paragraph to read
You say that and I say that, but then only for people would actually buy one with a manual.
I think sales are less important than marketing as a halo car. Manual cars aren’t very profitable, but they create clout, the existence of a manual 911/718 sells Cayennes, not 911’s.
Companies like Alfa Romeo live and die by their image, if the 4C was reviewed as “driving Nirvana” or at least a valid Elise alternative by engagement-obsessed journalists, they might be selling a lot more
ToenailsTonales right now.Same goes for the Giulia QV, it could’ve been the all-around M3-killer and sold a whole lot of automatic Stelvios by association, but they tried to sell volume instead of image. A most un-Italian move.
The problem is companies like Alfa Romeo being run by people who should’ve been working Mitsubishi (air conditioning department, not cars) who think every product needs a massive profit margin and fail to understand basic customer engagement. BMW can make a soul-sucking, Mini-based crossover, and someone sells a kidney for it because it shares a climate control vent with a manual M2.
I know I sound like “Tony Start made this in a cave!” but the really crazy thing for me is that a manual option in the 4C would have been basically free for Alfa to develop. Their drivetrain is a tuned-up engine from an existing FWD car that ALREADY had a manual transmission. All it would take is 2 shift cables, an off-the-shelf shifter, and a single hydraulic line for the clutch. Now you have a car that everyone loves even if they don’t buy it, and you can use that to sell everything by association.
Elises sell Eletres
911’s sell Cayennes
M2’s sell X5’s
GTI’s sell Atlases
GR86’s sell Rav4’s
CTR’s sell Passports
Miatas sell CX-30’s
Cooper S’s sell Countrymen
Alpine isn’t off the hook, either. Same story, just in blue.
The low payload is the second-most ridiculous part of the 4C, behind the fact that it’s automatic only. If ever there was a car begging for a manual transmission, this would be in the running.
I’ve found it hilarious since Day 0 of the North American relaunch that Alfa focused on being the “driver’s choice” luxury brand to differentiate themselves, but they literally never offered a manual here
…yes, it annoys me also, but they don’t offer it because only about 10% of buyers would opt for one. It costs a lot to certify cars with different transmissions, so they don’t bother. Alfa Romeo isn’t not alone in this.
Then don’t focus on being the driver brand. There are cost sacrifices to be made when a brand makes this their focus. You’re making excuses for a very incoherent business plan. Their sales reflect the utter failure of it
Funny enough, I perused the 4C forums to see if anyone’s tried to add a manual to one, like a Fiat Punto or Alfa MiTo transmission, and all I found was some guy asking “will the gated manual from the R8 fit? I’m thinking I’ll go with that”, which didn’t give me much faith as 1. that’s a longitudinal transmission with a transfer case, 2. he also wanted to swap in an engine that made “at least 500hp” into the space that’s fully occupied by a 1.7L, and 3/4 of the posts on the thread were “DCT is faster why would you swap”. Seems like Alfa Romeo customers are just as clueless as the company.
Meanwhile my regular Insight weighs 600lbs less and has a manual transmission. Kinda dont get the 4C.
Exactly. You’re comparing an Insight to a 4C.
This was an extremely amusing paragraph to read
You say that and I say that, but then only for people would actually buy one with a manual.
I think sales are less important than marketing as a halo car. Manual cars aren’t very profitable, but they create clout, the existence of a manual 911/718 sells Cayennes, not 911’s.
Companies like Alfa Romeo live and die by their image, if the 4C was reviewed as “driving Nirvana” or at least a valid Elise alternative by engagement-obsessed journalists, they might be selling a lot more
ToenailsTonales right now.Same goes for the Giulia QV, it could’ve been the all-around M3-killer and sold a whole lot of automatic Stelvios by association, but they tried to sell volume instead of image. A most un-Italian move.
The problem is companies like Alfa Romeo being run by people who should’ve been working Mitsubishi (air conditioning department, not cars) who think every product needs a massive profit margin and fail to understand basic customer engagement. BMW can make a soul-sucking, Mini-based crossover, and someone sells a kidney for it because it shares a climate control vent with a manual M2.
I know I sound like “Tony Start made this in a cave!” but the really crazy thing for me is that a manual option in the 4C would have been basically free for Alfa to develop. Their drivetrain is a tuned-up engine from an existing FWD car that ALREADY had a manual transmission. All it would take is 2 shift cables, an off-the-shelf shifter, and a single hydraulic line for the clutch. Now you have a car that everyone loves even if they don’t buy it, and you can use that to sell everything by association.
Elises sell Eletres
911’s sell Cayennes
M2’s sell X5’s
GTI’s sell Atlases
GR86’s sell Rav4’s
CTR’s sell Passports
Miatas sell CX-30’s
Cooper S’s sell Countrymen
Alpine isn’t off the hook, either. Same story, just in blue.